How Much Money Should Amaral Sue The McCanns For?

Thanks for your explanation aiyoyo. Would Dr Amaral have been able to keep some money back to enable him to feed and clothe his wife, his children and himself and his household bills, including his mortgage?

kathyBelle wrote:Thanks for your explanation aiyoyo. Would Dr Amaral have been able to keep some money back to enable him to feed and clothe his wife, his children and himself and his household bills, including his mortgage?

If he is successful in his application to unfreeze his assets then there is no reason why he couldnt use it as he sees fit, to do anything he wants with it really. It's his money in the first place.

In the first instance I dont understand how the Portugal legal systems could allow the mccanns' application before the trial is even scheduled to be heard. But the Portugal legal systems are in some parts medieval it seems or rather behind time.

I believe the mccanns wanted to prevent him shifting the money out of his name to other places so that in the event they won the case, there's something tangible to get their hands on.

Isnt it typical belief that in a libel case that people move their assets especially liquid beyond reach of plaintiff? That must also be the mccanns belief hence the premature action. But usually plaintiff takes that precaution after they have won the case and not before the case is heard. The mccanns is bit unusual in that they preempted the move before the trial is even heard, which just goes to show the astronomical sum asked plus this cunning move of theirs mean it wasnt about protection their good name, rather it was about their personal vendetta against Amaral ie to cripple him financially, and their greed ie to get their hands on his money.

If he couldnt unfreeze his assets before defamation trial, then he can now rely on book sales plus the social system as in his pension for his living. Surely the systems cant leave him and family with nothing to get by.

I still cant figure out how the freeze can be effected before trial in the first place, but I believe now that the ban is overturned surely his lawyers will work towards freeing his assets for use.

Judge Mental wrote:

mystique wrote:Hello to everyone.

Going back through your comments i must admit i read that what Mr Amaral said was "F**k the McCanns." However i have translated it and it ftands for force the McCanns, totally different to what others were saying.
As for Mr Amaral sueing the McCanns, can you counter sue? I am not up to speed on those issues so maybe someone can help out on those issues. I certainly would not like anyone to lose their houses because of what was wrote but if you spread lies and falsehoods you should receive some punishment.
Nobody knows what happened to little Madeleine except the one or the ones that did it, they know the real truth of what happened to her.

@ Mystique

What do you think it is that may be preventing them from telling us the real truth of what happened to Madeleine?

What punishment would you deem necessary for the spreading of all the lies and falsehoods?

Please be careful how you answer that question, Mystique, because Team McCann tend to get very touchy and threaten people with libel action if they feel somebody is slighting them in any way. However, one would be most interested in what you think about the Tapas 9 witness statements.

@Judge Mental I may be a lone voice in this but i do believe that the parents are innocent, but someone else that was there knows what happened on that night. Someone within the group that was there knows the real truth. That is my opinion

As for punishment towards the parents. If (as i believe) they are innocent, then they have paid a very heavy price. If however they are guilty of what others are saying then severe punishment should be enforced by the proper procedures.

Hi Mystique, the McCanns are not innocent and can never be innocent, by the fact they left their toddlers without adult supervision, when they went out in the evenings, which is against the law in Portugal.

They not only broke the law, but they lied to save their own skins and they lied because they knew they had broken the law.

mystique wrote:As for punishment towards the parents. If (as i believe) they are innocent, then they have paid a very heavy price. If however they are guilty of what others are saying then severe punishment should be enforced by the proper procedures.

Innocent you said? What a load of bullock! You're talking out of your arse.

Cadaverine was marked only in their holiday apartment and their belongings.

You mean someone in the group knows who killed Maddie (or how she died) and yet managed to spread cadaverine all over KM's pants of ganga, cuddle cat, et al and KM knew absolutely nothing?
She told the police officer about her dream of Maddie somewhere atop a coline and sent people with equipment to detect the beach; paid a loopy lawyer to drake the lake for Maddie remains and this is a parent who didnt know her daughter was died. Did she do those things for fun or was it also because it wasnt her own money?
This pair of parents are people who planned fund, anniversaries since very early days knowing v. well she would never be found (alive) and said confusion is good. And these are actions of innocents? Who are you kidding?

Give the two countries police and crime experts some credits for what they do.

The judges' conclusion was: no forensics support mccanns did the crime.
Is that the same as saying no crime was committed - I DONT THINK SO!
It just means there was A CRIME but couldnt narrow down to who is/are perpetrator/s.
Just mean there were evidence but insufficient to convict someone.
They were not made arguidos for nothing and even the judges conceded that!
Are you saying even the highest law enforces in the land have no skills and expertise in their specialised field?

You said if they are the perpetrators they should be severely punished by proper procedure ......now you tail is showing. You know very well they tried and are still trying to escape being caught hence punishment by simulation of abduction, charade, media spins and manipulations, threw they weight around using heavy duty lawyers and heavy duty mouthpiece, refused to cooperate, refused to answer questions, refused to return for reconstruction (yet made up their own to suit their convenience and tale ) and did all those silly things guilty people do when they try to escape apprehension and punishment. ARe these normal behaviours of innocents? They didnt even search for her for crying out LOUD.........they deleted their phone records.
Yet they knew nothing and someone else DID?
Are you saying they were covering up for someone? Who? Their friends? Their friends over their daughter? And that's their priority? Christ on a bike! Or do you mean a friend who violated their daughter and in the process she died and they knew nothing? Not that I believe that myself. I believe she died an accidental death in the presence of either one or both her parents from blunt object strike out towards her temple while she was standing somewhere high like a bed or sofa. Like a blow by her ALWAYS livid and angry parents when things dont go their way. Maybe she refused to go to bed or do as told and created a racket and that resulted in their lash out thus the fatalness. Maybe she refused to take the calpol and they lashed out at her....who knows exactly what happened.
But the police were convinced she died in the apt. That's good enough for me.
How do we know? Because they are no longer searching for her - simple as.

The mccanns were lucky to have influence. Most criminals just run and hide out in the woods, in isolation, even in another country if they managed to get that far.....but the mccanns......ah...the mccanns are different...they are middle-class doctors with connections....on top of which they are edcuated, vocally eloquent and adept at spinning. Dont be taken in by their spins unless you are worm from their woods and that's your party line!

Far as I am concerned they are 'runaway criminals' (even child neglect is a criminal offence) and they are damned lucky to be holed up in semi detached maison de mccanns, and not in a forestry because of their social class and connections.

No offence, but I am a direct person and like to give it straight. I dont beleive in your bull shit, period!

aiyoyo wrote:

Judge Mental wrote:

mystique wrote:Hello to everyone.

Going back through your comments i must admit i read that what Mr Amaral said was "F**k the McCanns." However i have translated it and it ftands for force the McCanns, totally different to what others were saying.
As for Mr Amaral sueing the McCanns, can you counter sue? I am not up to speed on those issues so maybe someone can help out on those issues. I certainly would not like anyone to lose their houses because of what was wrote but if you spread lies and falsehoods you should receive some punishment.
Nobody knows what happened to little Madeleine except the one or the ones that did it, they know the real truth of what happened to her.

@ Mystique

What do you think it is that may be preventing them from telling us the real truth of what happened to Madeleine?

What punishment would you deem necessary for the spreading of all the lies and falsehoods?

Please be careful how you answer that question, Mystique, because Team McCann tend to get very touchy and threaten people with libel action if they feel somebody is slighting them in any way. However, one would be most interested in what you think about the Tapas 9 witness statements.

I dont know how I missed mystique's post before?

So Mystique, who in your opinion is spreading lies and flasehoods? That sentence of yours is quite ambiquous to me.

Mystique,

You didnt even have the guts to answer my question!

You dont have to now as you answer is obvious after your last post.

If you think the investigators, vis a vis Amaral, is spreading lies and falsehood try telling that to the Judges.

Afterall it was the judges who concluded he wasnt......he was telling it as it is.
Like it or lump it, we dont care what you think. It's what the law tells me.

You are the only one coming on here to spread your lies and falsehood as far as we can see.
Unless you can produce evidence to support abduction or unless you have evidence to support your thesis that the mccanns didnt know what happened to Maddie but some one else did, then produce the evidence. Empty talk is meaningless........in fact it's COWDUNG.

No offence to the blunt response, but I dont think anyone like wolf among them.

mystique wrote:As for punishment towards the parents. If (as i believe) they are innocent, then they have paid a very heavy price. If however they are guilty of what others are saying then severe punishment should be enforced by the proper procedures.

Innocent of what? Exactly?

Shibboleth wrote:

mystique wrote:As for punishment towards the parents. If (as i believe) they are innocent, then they have paid a very heavy price. If however they are guilty of what others are saying then severe punishment should be enforced by the proper procedures.

Innocent of what? Exactly?

@ mystique

Your shroud appears to be made from a rather flimsy and transparent cloth which is not at all flattering or becoming.

aiyoyo wrote:

mystique wrote:As for punishment towards the parents. If (as i believe) they are innocent, then they have paid a very heavy price. If however they are guilty of what others are saying then severe punishment should be enforced by the proper procedures.

Innocent you said? What a load of bullock! You're talking out of your arse.

Cadaverine was marked only in their holiday apartment and their belongings.

You mean someone in the group knows who killed Maddie (or how she died) and yet managed to spread cadaverine all over KM's pants of ganga, cuddle cat, et al and KM knew absolutely nothing?
She told the police officer about her dream of Maddie somewhere atop a coline and sent people with equipment to detect the beach; paid a loopy lawyer to drake the lake for Maddie remains and this is a parent who didnt know her daughter was died. Did she do those things for fun or was it also because it wasnt her own money?
This pair of parents are people who planned fund, anniversaries since very early days knowing v. well she would never be found (alive) and said confusion is good. And these are actions of innocents? Who are you kidding?

Give the two countries police and crime experts some credits for what they do.

The judges' conclusion was: no forensics support mccanns did the crime.
Is that the same as saying no crime was committed - I DONT THINK SO!
It just means there was A CRIME but couldnt narrow down to who is/are perpetrator/s.
Just mean there were evidence but insufficient to convict someone.
They were not made arguidos for nothing and even the judges conceded that!
Are you saying even the highest law enforces in the land have no skills and expertise in their specialised field?

You said if they are the perpetrators they should be severely punished by proper procedure ......now you tail is showing. You know very well they tried and are still trying to escape being caught hence punishment by simulation of abduction, charade, media spins and manipulations, threw they weight around using heavy duty lawyers and heavy duty mouthpiece, refused to cooperate, refused to answer questions, refused to return for reconstruction (yet made up their own to suit their convenience and tale ) and did all those silly things guilty people do when they try to escape apprehension and punishment. ARe these normal behaviours of innocents? They didnt even search for her for crying out LOUD.........they deleted their phone records.
Yet they knew nothing and someone else DID?
Are you saying they were covering up for someone? Who? Their friends? Their friends over their daughter? And that's their priority? Christ on a bike! Or do you mean a friend who violated their daughter and in the process she died and they knew nothing? Not that I believe that myself. I believe she died an accidental death in the presence of either one or both her parents from blunt object strike out towards her temple while she was standing somewhere high like a bed or sofa. Like a blow by her ALWAYS livid and angry parents when things dont go their way. Maybe she refused to go to bed or do as told and created a racket and that resulted in their lash out thus the fatalness. Maybe she refused to take the calpol and they lashed out at her....who knows exactly what happened.
But the police were convinced she died in the apt. That's good enough for me.
How do we know? Because they are no longer searching for her - simple as.

The mccanns were lucky to have influence. Most criminals just run and hide out in the woods, in isolation, even in another country if they managed to get that far.....but the mccanns......ah...the mccanns are different...they are middle-class doctors with connections....on top of which they are edcuated, vocally eloquent and adept at spinning. Dont be taken in by their spins unless you are worm from their woods and that's your party line!

Far as I am concerned they are 'runaway criminals' (even child neglect is a criminal offence) and they are damned lucky to be holed up in semi detached maison de mccanns, and not in a forestry because of their social class and connections.

No offence, but I am a direct person and like to give it straight. I dont beleive in your bull shit, period!

I see the art of discussion is lost on you

The parents are guilty of leaving their kids alone, i agree. Yes they should be punished. The scent in the rooms, if someone else within the group had killed Madeleine, then they helped looked for Madeleine when she was reported missing, would that not have spread the scent around?
I thought the idea was to debate and not get shouted down by everyone. Look i agree the parents should be punished, but what Portuguese law did they break ? If they did break one why didn't the Portuguese Police charge them, that is what is puzzling me.
Going back to my theory, which member of the group had enough time to see Madeleine and have time to move Madeleine, yet miss Madeleine in the checks?

mystique wrote:The parents are guilty of leaving their kids alone, i agree. Yes they should be punished. The scent in the rooms, if someone else within the group had killed Madeleine, then they helped looked for Madeleine when she was reported missing, would that not have spread the scent around?
I thought the idea was to debate and not get shouted down by everyone. Look i agree the parents should be punished, but what Portuguese law did they break ? If they did break one why didn't the Portuguese Police charge them, that is what is puzzling me.
Going back to my theory, which member of the group had enough time to see Madeleine and have time to move Madeleine, yet miss Madeleine in the checks?

So how do you explain the scent on the key fob and in the car hired 25 days later? All the tapas 7 had gone home by then.

Leaving your kids alone breaks no UK laws as well they knew, maybe they thought the same applied in Portugal. I don't believe they left their kids alone apart from when they "set up" the abduction.

@ mystique

The art of discussion is one of aiyoyo's specialities, and we would like you to stay around long enough to derive nourishment from aiyoyo's offerings.

One is able to see that you certainly have some passion for the case. However, one is very much troubled by the fact that you are unaware that the Portuguese have stiff laws regarding leaving children unattended.

You say: If they did break one why didn't the Portuguese Police charge them, that is what is puzzling me.

This is one of the most puzzling things about the case for everybody, mystique. Even Amaral himself, felt that the McCanns were treated with 'tweezers' and very much protected by the British Establishment.

Hi Judge Mental, Goncalo Amaral said that the British Government intervened when they wanted to prosecute the McCanns.

kathyBelle wrote:Hi Judge Mental, Goncalo Amaral said that the British Government intervened when they wanted to prosecute the McCanns.

Amaral knows he was up against British intervenion and interference from the very moment that the abduction was announced to the world's media.

Hi Judge Mental, I've just been looking at the archives on Joana's (Morais) forum, for a thread that gave information about the court case in Lisbon, early on this year. One report said that the PJ had been advised by the British Police to make the McCanns suspects.

At the moment I'm reading a transcript of an interview, where Clarence Mitchell is spinning for the McCanns along with his usual drivel, he is just talking about the fund. He says the fund is there to assist Kate and Gerry, in whatever way necessary. He says that the bulk, in fact all of the public money, that came in, in the early stages, was spent entirely properly in the search for Madeleine. He goes on to say that the money that is left in the fund is from the settlements from media outlets that defamed the McCanns. As well as money from fund raising events.

He goes on to say that the fund raisers will be more than happy to see the money assisting Kate and Gerry and their wider family, as well as their investigators. I wonder why the McCanns wider family need assistance, from money that was raised to find Madeleine.

If you or anyone else wants to read this transcript, it is dated the 19th of February 2010. There is also a video where you can watch and listen to Clarence "spinning." In fact if you're having a bad hair day, take a look at Clarence's hair and you will see that your hair isn't as bad as you thought it was. Then again you might like Clarence's hairstyle.

Amaral should sue them for the same amount (€1.2 million) that they are seeking from him.
Should it go ahead, their libel trial would seem to be on very shaky ground, as the facts that they are basing their action on are now the facts that have seen the book-ban overturned.
Mr. A should then take his costs out of the settlement, and give the rest to The Fund.
He doesn't need to shame them, they do that themselves.
As a good Catholic, he can show them for what they really are.
I hope, and believe, that Justice for Madeleine will come about eventually, and that Amaral will be shown to be right.

kathyBelle wrote:Hi Judge Mental, I've just been looking at the archives on Joana's (Morais) forum, for a thread that gave information about the court case in Lisbon, early on this year. One report said that the PJ had been advised by the British Police to make the McCanns suspects.

At the moment I'm reading a transcript of an interview, where Clarence Mitchell is spinning for the McCanns along with his usual drivel, he is just talking about the fund. He says the fund is there to assist Kate and Gerry, in whatever way necessary. He says that the bulk, in fact all of the public money, that came in, in the early stages, was spent entirely properly in the search for Madeleine. He goes on to say that the money that is left in the fund is from the settlements from media outlets that defamed the McCanns. As well as money from fund raising events.

He goes on to say that the fund raisers will be more than happy to see the money assisting Kate and Gerry and their wider family, as well as their investigators. I wonder why the McCanns wider family need assistance, from money that was raised to find Madeleine.

If you or anyone else wants to read this transcript, it is dated the 19th of February 2010. There is also a video where you can watch and listen to Clarence "spinning." In fact if you're having a bad hair day, take a look at Clarence's hair and you will see that your hair isn't as bad as you thought it was. Then again you might like Clarence's hairstyle.

I think this is the one you mean. A caution - this video should be x rated on account of Clarence's hair! Listen where he says K & G didn't start this action.................err well who did. According to him the public money was spent some time ago, and this is the "suing" money left in the fund. Where on earth did over 2 million pounds go?

fatbill, and welcome. Sorry missed your post earlier.

mystique wrote:

aiyoyo wrote:

mystique wrote:As for punishment towards the parents. If (as i believe) they are innocent, then they have paid a very heavy price. If however they are guilty of what others are saying then severe punishment should be enforced by the proper procedures.

Innocent you said? What a load of bullock! You're talking out of your arse.

Cadaverine was marked only in their holiday apartment and their belongings.

You mean someone in the group knows who killed Maddie (or how she died) and yet managed to spread cadaverine all over KM's pants of ganga, cuddle cat, et al and KM knew absolutely nothing?
She told the police officer about her dream of Maddie somewhere atop a coline and sent people with equipment to detect the beach; paid a loopy lawyer to drake the lake for Maddie remains and this is a parent who didnt know her daughter was died. Did she do those things for fun or was it also because it wasnt her own money?
This pair of parents are people who planned fund, anniversaries since very early days knowing v. well she would never be found (alive) and said confusion is good. And these are actions of innocents? Who are you kidding?

Give the two countries police and crime experts some credits for what they do.

The judges' conclusion was: no forensics support mccanns did the crime.
Is that the same as saying no crime was committed - I DONT THINK SO!
It just means there was A CRIME but couldnt narrow down to who is/are perpetrator/s.
Just mean there were evidence but insufficient to convict someone.
They were not made arguidos for nothing and even the judges conceded that!
Are you saying even the highest law enforces in the land have no skills and expertise in their specialised field?

You said if they are the perpetrators they should be severely punished by proper procedure ......now you tail is showing. You know very well they tried and are still trying to escape being caught hence punishment by simulation of abduction, charade, media spins and manipulations, threw they weight around using heavy duty lawyers and heavy duty mouthpiece, refused to cooperate, refused to answer questions, refused to return for reconstruction (yet made up their own to suit their convenience and tale ) and did all those silly things guilty people do when they try to escape apprehension and punishment. ARe these normal behaviours of innocents? They didnt even search for her for crying out LOUD.........they deleted their phone records.
Yet they knew nothing and someone else DID?
Are you saying they were covering up for someone? Who? Their friends? Their friends over their daughter? And that's their priority? Christ on a bike! Or do you mean a friend who violated their daughter and in the process she died and they knew nothing? Not that I believe that myself. I believe she died an accidental death in the presence of either one or both her parents from blunt object strike out towards her temple while she was standing somewhere high like a bed or sofa. Like a blow by her ALWAYS livid and angry parents when things dont go their way. Maybe she refused to go to bed or do as told and created a racket and that resulted in their lash out thus the fatalness. Maybe she refused to take the calpol and they lashed out at her....who knows exactly what happened.
But the police were convinced she died in the apt. That's good enough for me.
How do we know? Because they are no longer searching for her - simple as.

The mccanns were lucky to have influence. Most criminals just run and hide out in the woods, in isolation, even in another country if they managed to get that far.....but the mccanns......ah...the mccanns are different...they are middle-class doctors with connections....on top of which they are edcuated, vocally eloquent and adept at spinning. Dont be taken in by their spins unless you are worm from their woods and that's your party line!

Far as I am concerned they are 'runaway criminals' (even child neglect is a criminal offence) and they are damned lucky to be holed up in semi detached maison de mccanns, and not in a forestry because of their social class and connections.

No offence, but I am a direct person and like to give it straight. I dont beleive in your bull shit, period!

I see the art of discussion is lost on you

Art of discussion is reserved for people deserving it, not to be wasted on someone like you who spread lies and falsehood.

I see the art of deception is your speciality.

fatbill wrote:Amaral should sue them for the same amount (€1.2 million) that they are seeking from him.
Should it go ahead, their libel trial would seem to be on very shaky ground, as the facts that they are basing their action on are now the facts that have seen the book-ban overturned.
Mr. A should then take his costs out of the settlement, and give the rest to The Fund.
He doesn't need to shame them, they do that themselves.
As a good Catholic, he can show them for what they really are.
I hope, and believe, that Justice for Madeleine will come about eventually, and that Amaral will be shown to be right.

Hi Fatbill, if Dr Amaral is paid damages from the McCanns and after he takes his expenses from the money, he wants to donate the rest, he should not donate to the fund to find Madeleine. Written in the terms of the fund is a clause to say the McCanns are able to use the fund money to aid their finances. As if that wasn't bad enough the McCanns wider family are being aided by the fund.

If Dr Amaral wants to donate to a children's charity, he should find a charity in Portugal.

mystique wrote:The parents are guilty of leaving their kids alone, i agree. Yes they should be punished. The scent in the rooms, if someone else within the group had killed Madeleine, then they helped looked for Madeleine when she was reported missing, would that not have spread the scent around?
I thought the idea was to debate and not get shouted down by everyone. Look i agree the parents should be punished, but what Portuguese law did they break ? If they did break one why didn't the Portuguese Police charge them, that is what is puzzling me.
Going back to my theory, which member of the group had enough time to see Madeleine and have time to move Madeleine, yet miss Madeleine in the checks?

You are evidently practising selective reading and coming on to argue selectively.

Have you read the panel of three judges latest rulings? Well, this lot of judges are highly critical of the first instance judge and also critical to a lesser degree of the mccanns.
They stated that the AG's final delivery was but his interpretation and if presented in court might yield different interpretation.
They also stated that their arguidos status was released because of lack of forensics evidence to implicate the parents, not that there is no evidence of a crime.
They also stated that analysing evidence is more Amaral's speciality than the AG's and that Amaral with his rich experience was right to draw conclusion required of his job.
They noticed the mccanns did themselves no favour when they didnt co-operate for the reconstruction despite circumstances set to suit them. Plus there were plenty inconsistencies and circumstantial evidence so they could see where the investigators were coming from when they formulated that thesis.

The judges rulings made it clear the mccanns were not exonerated.
So, don't keep bragging about they were not charged......WAIT....be patient!
Getting criminals properly with safe conviction is about waiting for one crucial bit of irrefutable evidence.

There's rumour the case will be reopened, thought I cant see how.
What is more certain is that this ruling is a hugh setback for the mccanns, probably no come back for them to replay the AG's summation, and this ruling will be taken into account by judge presiding libel trial.

So let's see how long the mccanns can bleat on about their innonence!

And is it not true that the three judges also made enquiries of their own in order to support their verdict?

@ mystique

Proceed with caution dear fellow. One is having one of those days where the gout is so bitingly painful, it is leaving one with very little patience.

kathyBelle wrote:

fatbill wrote:Amaral should sue them for the same amount (€1.2 million) that they are seeking from him.
Should it go ahead, their libel trial would seem to be on very shaky ground, as the facts that they are basing their action on are now the facts that have seen the book-ban overturned.
Mr. A should then take his costs out of the settlement, and give the rest to The Fund.
He doesn't need to shame them, they do that themselves.
As a good Catholic, he can show them for what they really are.
I hope, and believe, that Justice for Madeleine will come about eventually, and that Amaral will be shown to be right.

Hi Fatbill, if Dr Amaral is paid damages from the McCanns and after he takes his expenses from the money, he wants to donate the rest, he should not donate to the fund to find Madeleine. Written in the terms of the fund is a clause to say the McCanns are able to use the fund money to aid their finances. As if that wasn't bad enough the McCanns wider family are being aided by the fund.

If Dr Amaral wants to donate to a children's charity, he should find a charity in Portugal.

I'm sorry, I don't know what I was thinking.
Seeing Mr Pink has brought me crashing back to Earth.
Where the hell did he get that hair?
You'd have thought he could get fifty quid out of the Fund for a decent rug.

Oh, how I hope that their defamation action goes ahead.
Or will Carter-Ruck advise them to slink away quietly?