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"Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

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"Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by Tony Bennett on 28.09.16 20:08

Normally I would not bring Blacksmith's scatological, pompous and hate-filled ramblings to the forum, but I'm making an exception for today's offering:

http://blacksmithbureau.blogspot.co.uk/2016/09/predictable.html

Two things of especial interest stand out.

One is the almost pathological desperation to attempt to 'prove' that Madeleine really was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3 May. He doesn't name the four witnesses he refers to, but they are: Kate McCann, Gerry McCann, Catriona Baker and Charlotte Pennington.

The second is the vindictive, hate-filled vitriol he pours out against Lizzy HideHo, a member here and very much a respected researcher in the minds of nearly all true Madeleine McCann researchers. 

He has clearly been brooding on this topic for months. Not for him, though, the painstaking research, analysis and cross-checking that would prove that he is right.

No, it's Lizzy HideHo that does that sort of thing. And has compiled a very long list of contradictions about that alleged high tea. 

And obviously Blacksmith really really doesn't like what she is saying.  

There is clearly a struggle going on for who's right and who's wrong about those claims about the Thursday afternoon 'high tea' said to have taken place on Thursday 3 May.

At least we now know where Blacksmith stands on this critical factual issue.

I will add a poll

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by MayMuse on 28.09.16 20:48

I read it earlier, simply no need for it. 
That is what I call "nasty" @TonyBennett or maybe stronger? 
"VILE"
He can't even spell HiDeHo correctly. 
All this backstabbing & point-scoring achieves no "truth" for Madeleine. Muddying the waters!
What purpose does it serve? 
Have we forgotten Brenda Leyland, it's coming up for two years!

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by Verdi on 28.09.16 23:01

@Tony Bennett wrote:Normally I would not bring Blacksmith's scatological, pompous and hate-filled ramblings to the forum, but I'm making an exception for today's offering:

No disrespect but I think it would be better left where it belongs, it's childish in the extreme - I wouldn't grace the coven with so much as a look in.

Strange how may times I've questioned who these reliable witnesses are that saw Madeleine at high-tea on Thursday 3rd May 2007 - I'm still waiting for the answer.

Interesting to note how, whilst this obscure blog doesn't attract any serious attention, it is applauded by the McCann support network on certain occasions.  Why would that be I wonder.

Double, double toil and trouble;

Fire burn and caldron bubble.

Fillet of a fenny snake,

In the caldron boil and bake;

Eye of newt and toe of frog,

Wool of bat and tongue of dog,

Adder's fork and blind-worm's sting,

Lizard's leg and howlet's wing,

For a charm of powerful trouble,

Like a hell-broth boil and bubble.



Double, double toil and trouble;

Fire burn and caldron bubble.

Cool it with a baboon's blood,

Then the charm is firm and good.

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by sharonl on 28.09.16 23:11

The McCanns don't want anyone questioning their activities between  April 29th and May 2nd do they?  They, their trolls, and the UK gutter press, have tried so hard to convince us that "Madeleine disappeared from her bed on the evening May 3rd 2007 whilst her parents ate at the local tapas", obviously this was meant to divert the investigation and to stop the police from looking too closely at the events of those previous days. 

We have:

False sightings of Madeleine in those previous days, none of which can be verified and not from independent sources.
David Paynes' false claim of seeing all three children that evening
Kate McCanns stories of what Madeleine did or said  - the crying incident or "mummy this is the best day ever"
The alleged trip to the beach
The alleged boat trip with nanny & McCann friend Cat Baker
The falsified photographs
The bizarre Smith sighting - (Smith was visited by Brian Kennedy)

This is just a small sample of a large plot to convince us all that May 3rd  was the actual date of Madeleines' disappearance

In addition to this, we have a number of people (dummy friends) on the internet who are pretending to be McCann sceptics but are keeping us from uncovering the truth by promoting the May 3rd scenario and stopping us from looking back to 29th April.

These trolls are either members of the Wright family, paid up internet trolls or people with very sinister backgrounds who fear that if the game was up the McCanns it may be up with them too.

This blogger troll called Blacksmith is obviously one of these dummy friends, although we don't know what his personal reasons for covering up the actual date of Madeleines' death are.  All that I can say is ignore him, he writes a load of nonsense and in the scheme  of things he's probably just small fry.

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by Verdi on 28.09.16 23:13

@sharonl wrote:
This blogger troll called Blacksmith is obviously one of these dummy friends, although we don't know what his personal reasons for covering up the actual date of Madeleines' death are.  All that I can say is ignore him, he writes a load of nonsense and in the scheme  of things he's probably just small fry.
thumbsup

NB:  Small fry who thinks it's a big shot!

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by Verdi on 28.09.16 23:29

3 He's a pompous, foul-mouthed egotist who's been wrong countless times and keeps on attacking those who've done the most research on the case


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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by sharonl on 28.09.16 23:39

@Verdi wrote:3 He's a pompous, foul-mouthed egotist who's been wrong countless times and keeps on attacking those who've done the most research on the case



Sounds a bit like that Muppet, Mitchell. 

There is a positive side to this though.  These trolls only come to life when someone gets  too close to the truth.  They are a great indicator of when you are on the right track.  

So thank you Blacksmith thumbsup

I was almost sure that April 29th was the date of Madeleines' death, now I am 100% certain

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by MayMuse on 28.09.16 23:40

Just veering off slightly from Blacksmith to Brian Kennedy ( they do both begin with a B) winkwink


We are led to believe that BK is/was a benefactor lulled into action by the plight of Madeleine? 
He was welcomed by the McCanns without question?
Yet his actions and money have been utilised as far as I can see, by "shady" dealings (Metodo 3, The Private Investigators Edgar/Cowley etc)
By all accounts it appears there was some form of interference eg. Meeting with Martin Smith and Robert Murat?
 

He is not an investigator of any kind, does not have experience in finding missing people etc yet stepped in to do what? His "generosity" has not brought any results, only highlighted fraudulent dealings? What was in it for him? A good deed, self promotion? Something more sinister? 

Which brings me on to a few questions? 
Is there any evidence that he knew of the McCanns ( or perhaps any of their group/family/friends)  prior to Madeleine going missing? 
Why is he not on OG radar, he interfered with a "suspect" in the disappearance of Madeleine? bignono

Why haven't OG investigated those 'shady' goings on/ connections brought in by Mr Kennedy? 

Does anyone else think that Brian Kennedy's eager "participation" is questionable? 


As for BlackSmith, I think it's all BS! 

IMO

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by Tony Bennett on 29.09.16 0:03

@MayMuse wrote:Just veering off slightly...to Brian Kennedy...

We are led to believe that BK is/was a benefactor lulled into action by the plight of Madeleine? 
He was welcomed by the McCanns without question?
Yet his actions and money have been utilised as far as I can see, by "shady" dealings (Metodo 3 etc)
By all accounts it appears there was some form of interference eg. Meeting with Martin Smith and Robert Murat?

REPLY: Yes, we are off topic, but these are very good points you raise.
 
He is not an investigator of any kind, does not have experience in finding missing people etc yet stepped in to do what? His "generosity" has not brought any results, only highlighted fraudulent dealings? What was in it for him? A good deed, self promotion? Something more sinister? 

REPLY: More good points and questions.

Which brings me on to a few questions? 
Is there any evidence that he knew of the McCanns (or perhaps any of their group/family/friends)  prior to Madeleine going missing? 

REPLY: The account we are given in Kate's book, 'madeleine' (pages 268-270), runs like this. The McCanns flew back to Rothley on Sunday 9 September 2007. On Wednesday 12 September 2007, out of the blue so it is said, the McCanns were contacted by senior East Lancashire Freemason Edward Smethurst, a lawyer. He said he worked for Brian Kennedy who had been concerned about the McCanns' plight and wanted to help. Whatever the truth about this, on Friday 14 September a top London lawyer, Angus McBride, drove all the way up from London, collected the McCanns, and drove them down to a meeting in London where they met Brian Kennedy, allegedly for the first time, and a host of lawyers and public relations folk. At this meeting, it was agreed that Kennedy would run the private investigation and that Smethurst would be the McCanns' co-ordinating lawyer, which he has been ever since.

If that seems remarkably quick work to you, well it does to me as well.

There is no proof of Kennedy being involved before 12 September but there have been some indications that he was.

It is also an almighty coincidence that we know that Edward Smethurst had been holidaying every summer in Praia da Luz since 1999 with one or other of his three families (he has been married twice and had a mistress; he has two children by each).   
 

Why is he not on OG radar, he interfered with a "suspect" in the disappearance of Madeleine? 
Why haven't OG investigated those 'shady' goings on/ connections brought in by Mr Kennedy? 

REPLY: Simple. OG's remit doesn't allow them to go there. That's why Jill made such a big issue of this in her letter to Theresa May.   

Does anyone else think that Brian Kennedy's eager "participation" is questionable? 

REPLY: I think a great many members have thought exactlyh this over the past six-and-three-quarter years this forum has ben going.

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by MRNOODLES on 29.09.16 0:04

Can I ask this?


If you disagree... you disagree, but why has he/she/LBGT got to be a total c*** about it?

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by sharonl on 29.09.16 0:07

@MayMuse wrote:Just veering off slightly from Blacksmith to Brian Kennedy ( they do both begin with a B) winkwink


We are led to believe that BK is/was a benefactor lulled into action by the plight of Madeleine? 
He was welcomed by the McCanns without question?
Yet his actions and money have been utilised as far as I can see, by "shady" dealings (Metodo 3, The Private Investigators Edgar/Cowley etc)
By all accounts it appears there was some form of interference eg. Meeting with Martin Smith and Robert Murat?
 

He is not an investigator of any kind, does not have experience in finding missing people etc yet stepped in to do what? His "generosity" has not brought any results, only highlighted fraudulent dealings? What was in it for him? A good deed, self promotion? Something more sinister? 

Which brings me on to a few questions? 
Is there any evidence that he knew of the McCanns ( or perhaps any of their group/family/friends)  prior to Madeleine going missing? 
Why is he not on OG radar, he interfered with a "suspect" in the disappearance of Madeleine? bignono

Why haven't OG investigated those 'shady' goings on/ connections brought in by Mr Kennedy? 

Does anyone else think that Brian Kennedy's eager "participation" is questionable? 


As for BlackSmith, I think it's all BS! 

IMO

Operation Grange was handed a large dossier of evidence  regarding the activities of Brian Kennedy, obviously they have ignored that.

Kennedy once worked very closely with Edward Smethurst (fund director) until a bust up.  Smethurt had been taking family holidays in PDL for 13 years.

I did wonder if Kennedys interest in the case was via Smethurst but maybe not.

Wynard who like Branson, paid nothing to find Madeleine but gave £100,000 to the McCanns to help clear their names, owns Stobo Castle.  The wayback Machine tells us that Stobo offered "10% discount to Spa club members", a seemingly innocent offer, but where have we heard that phrase before?

We also have the web page for gay cruising at Heathrow - why were both Kennedy and Smethursts names on this?

We need to ask ourselves whether Kennedy or Smethurst, or any of their many companies, own guest houses or hotels near PDL.

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by Rogue-a-Tory on 29.09.16 0:08

Here the McCanns are self-serving, so we're left with Catriona Baker & Charlotte Pennington. Hmmmmmm

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by JRP on 29.09.16 8:25

What an absolute waste of Web space that dross is, if it's got an audience wider than him I'd be amazed. 
Voted option 3

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by Verdi on 29.09.16 12:24

@JRP wrote:What an absolute waste of Web space that dross is, if it's got an audience wider than him I'd be amazed. 
Voted option 3
Well, he must be right because he says he is - who am I to argue!

I am aware of about half a dozen hard core members of this elite society of self proclaimed erudites - assuming them not one and the same, could be as they have the same style.  There are also a few acolytes with different reasons for lauding the blog - one, a blogger and forum foe, is an old time jezebel who takes every opportunity to slate this forum, in particular Mr. Bennett, if not directly these days then by encouraging others to do so.

The agenda has always been clear to me - to destroy the work and reputation of the people who have dedicated so much of their time and energy to uncovering the truth about Madeleine McCann.  The main target is always Tony Bennett, Jill Havern, HideHo, Hobs and this forum generally but it doesn't stop there - Goncalo Amaral, the PJ and even poor old Textusa are frequent targets of the self proclaimed erudites vitriol.

See the pattern?  That, in my opinion, is not the work of anyone whose concerns are for Madeleine McCann.

Still, one good thing to come out of all this, to coin a phrase, the forum must be doing something right thumbsup !

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by April28th on 29.09.16 13:02

Subversion, nothing more.

If we were to actually read the files, aside from the parents, Cat last gives a time to seeing Madeleine as 14:45, Charlotte is as credible as a Sam Allardyce betting ring, and Payne's 'visit' has more holes in it than a block of swiss cheese.

Kate's pre-arguido says Madeleine was there with the twins at 1720-30. Cat just says Kate left to get Madeleine.

The most damning thing for me, since I noticed it, has been Kate's complete lack of 'last time she saw Madeleine'

Before leaving they checked on the children, she doesn't know who; however Gerry says it was him. She only knows the children were quiet.


So the last time she saw her daughter may have been before they left, but may not be, the last time she saw her face isn't really a concern?



ETA - People who sling mud from afar do noone any good. I have been fortunate to get to know Lizzy and you couldn't meet a nicer person. She has worked tirelessly for years on this. A lot of my own research would have taken months longer if not for Lizzy's work compiling timelines and such.

The derision shown here is completely uncalled for. If people disagree, debate is healthy. But this guy/girl effectively opts to invoke Godwin's law and insult her instead. The fact negativity is only flowing from one direction tells you everything you need to know.

ETA 2 - he/she also cites Wilding, who said the following;

She remembers that during the afternoon of May 3 Madeleine was at the Mini Club, but she does not remember at what time she arrived, and if on that day Madeleine accompanied the other children at 1645 as was customary.

No mention of 1730, of Madeleine being picked up, only a vague reference that she 'saw her that afternoon'

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by JRP on 29.09.16 14:04

@Verdi wrote:
@JRP wrote:What an absolute waste of Web space that dross is, if it's got an audience wider than him I'd be amazed. 
Voted option 3
Well, he must be right because he says he is - who am I to argue!

I am aware of about half a dozen hard core members of this elite society of self proclaimed erudites - assuming them not one and the same, could be as they have the same style.  There are also a few acolytes with different reasons for lauding the blog - one, a blogger and forum foe, is an old time jezebel who takes every opportunity to slate this forum, in particular Mr. Bennett, if not directly these days then by encouraging others to do so.

The agenda has always been clear to me - to destroy the work and reputation of the people who have dedicated so much of their time and energy to uncovering the truth about Madeleine McCann.  The main target is always Tony Bennett, Jill Havern, HideHo, Hobs and this forum generally but it doesn't stop there - Goncalo Amaral, the PJ and even poor old Textusa are frequent targets of the self proclaimed erudites vitriol.

See the pattern?  That, in my opinion, is not the work of anyone whose concerns are for Madeleine McCann.

Still, one good thing to come out of all this, to coin a phrase, the forum must be doing something right thumbsup 
Are the four witnesses the McCanns, Cat Baker and Charlotte Pennington? Why not five? Why not the visiting doctor who visited Kate to see if eeerrm I can't quite remember what he wanted now. But no matter, neither could he. 
So maybe Blacksmith thinks he wasn't really there? Thats a "credible" witness who places Madeleine alive at 6pm. Or was it 6.30? 7pm? Details details. 

The problem is Verdi, that when their claims are complete bullsh*t and back fitting, it becomes very difficult to argue against facts, so they resort to spewing vitriol on those they see as the leaders, Tony, Jill, Hideho and others such as Richard Hall.

But there are many members here who contribute to interesting and factual debate, yourself included, and one day it will all pay off thumbsup

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by MayMuse on 29.09.16 14:21

Thank you @TonyBennett & @Sharoni
Answered some of my questions, think I need to ponder more on "connections"?

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by Verdi on 29.09.16 15:38

@JRP wrote:
@Verdi wrote:
@JRP wrote:What an absolute waste of Web space that dross is, if it's got an audience wider than him I'd be amazed. 
Voted option 3
Well, he must be right because he says he is - who am I to argue!

I am aware of about half a dozen hard core members of this elite society of self proclaimed erudites - assuming them not one and the same, could be as they have the same style.  There are also a few acolytes with different reasons for lauding the blog - one, a blogger and forum foe, is an old time jezebel who takes every opportunity to slate this forum, in particular Mr. Bennett, if not directly these days then by encouraging others to do so.

The agenda has always been clear to me - to destroy the work and reputation of the people who have dedicated so much of their time and energy to uncovering the truth about Madeleine McCann.  The main target is always Tony Bennett, Jill Havern, HideHo, Hobs and this forum generally but it doesn't stop there - Goncalo Amaral, the PJ and even poor old Textusa are frequent targets of the self proclaimed erudites vitriol.

See the pattern?  That, in my opinion, is not the work of anyone whose concerns are for Madeleine McCann.

Still, one good thing to come out of all this, to coin a phrase, the forum must be doing something right thumbsup 
Are the four witnesses the McCanns, Cat Baker and Charlotte Pennington? Why not five? Why not the visiting doctor who visited Kate to see if eeerrm I can't quite remember what he wanted now. But no matter, neither could he. 
So maybe Blacksmith thinks he wasn't really there? Thats a "credible" witness who places Madeleine alive at 6pm. Or was it 6.30? 7pm? Details details. 

The problem is Verdi, that when their claims are complete bullsh*t and back fitting, it becomes very difficult to argue against facts, so they resort to spewing vitriol on those they see as the leaders, Tony, Jill, Hideho and others such as Richard Hall.

But there are many members here who contribute to interesting and factual debate, yourself included, and one day it will all pay off thumbsup
I apologize profusely - off the top of my head I didn't include Richard D. Hall or PeterMac, who's had his fair share of vitriol overthe years.  There are probably others so forgive me if I've neglected anyone.

Would that be the missing doctor who paid that haunting visitation to Ms Healy, she enwrapped in towel, to check her credentials - either that or her pulse!

Yep, that's the usual form - can't come up with the goods so lash out with abuse.  Pathetic!

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by JRP on 29.09.16 16:46

@Verdi wrote:
@JRP wrote:
@Verdi wrote:
@JRP wrote:What an absolute waste of Web space that dross is, if it's got an audience wider than him I'd be amazed. 
Voted option 3
Well, he must be right because he says he is - who am I to argue!

I am aware of about half a dozen hard core members of this elite society of self proclaimed erudites - assuming them not one and the same, could be as they have the same style.  There are also a few acolytes with different reasons for lauding the blog - one, a blogger and forum foe, is an old time jezebel who takes every opportunity to slate this forum, in particular Mr. Bennett, if not directly these days then by encouraging others to do so.

The agenda has always been clear to me - to destroy the work and reputation of the people who have dedicated so much of their time and energy to uncovering the truth about Madeleine McCann.  The main target is always Tony Bennett, Jill Havern, HideHo, Hobs and this forum generally but it doesn't stop there - Goncalo Amaral, the PJ and even poor old Textusa are frequent targets of the self proclaimed erudites vitriol.

See the pattern?  That, in my opinion, is not the work of anyone whose concerns are for Madeleine McCann.

Still, one good thing to come out of all this, to coin a phrase, the forum must be doing something right thumbsup 
Are the four witnesses the McCanns, Cat Baker and Charlotte Pennington? Why not five? Why not the visiting doctor who visited Kate to see if eeerrm I can't quite remember what he wanted now. But no matter, neither could he. 
So maybe Blacksmith thinks he wasn't really there? Thats a "credible" witness who places Madeleine alive at 6pm. Or was it 6.30? 7pm? Details details. 

The problem is Verdi, that when their claims are complete bullsh*t and back fitting, it becomes very difficult to argue against facts, so they resort to spewing vitriol on those they see as the leaders, Tony, Jill, Hideho and others such as Richard Hall.

But there are many members here who contribute to interesting and factual debate, yourself included, and one day it will all pay off thumbsup
I apologize profusely - off the top of my head I didn't include Richard D. Hall or PeterMac, who's had his fair share of vitriol overthe years.  There are probably others so forgive me if I've neglected anyone.

Would that be the missing doctor who paid that haunting visitation to Ms Healy, she enwrapped in towel, to check her credentials - either that or her pulse!

Yep, that's the usual form - can't come up with the goods so lash out with abuse.  Pathetic!

That is he, a man who struggled with the word towel. But hey, perhaps he was never there, like the illusive pimpernel.


OK so now I'm going to ask you to recollect what everybody was wearing. 

David Payne: I'm afraid that is, you know I'm, I cannot recall at all. You know that's, you'd think that was an obvious thing to remember. I cannot remember, as I say the, from the children point of view predominantly, I can remember the, you know, white, but I couldn't say exactly what they were wearing.... eeer 

Could you remember what Kate was wearing for example?

David Payne: I can't, no!

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by Verdi on 29.09.16 20:37

@JRP wrote:
@Verdi wrote:
@JRP wrote:
@Verdi wrote:
@JRP wrote:What an absolute waste of Web space that dross is, if it's got an audience wider than him I'd be amazed. 
Voted option 3
Well, he must be right because he says he is - who am I to argue!

I am aware of about half a dozen hard core members of this elite society of self proclaimed erudites - assuming them not one and the same, could be as they have the same style.  There are also a few acolytes with different reasons for lauding the blog - one, a blogger and forum foe, is an old time jezebel who takes every opportunity to slate this forum, in particular Mr. Bennett, if not directly these days then by encouraging others to do so.

The agenda has always been clear to me - to destroy the work and reputation of the people who have dedicated so much of their time and energy to uncovering the truth about Madeleine McCann.  The main target is always Tony Bennett, Jill Havern, HideHo, Hobs and this forum generally but it doesn't stop there - Goncalo Amaral, the PJ and even poor old Textusa are frequent targets of the self proclaimed erudites vitriol.

See the pattern?  That, in my opinion, is not the work of anyone whose concerns are for Madeleine McCann.

Still, one good thing to come out of all this, to coin a phrase, the forum must be doing something right thumbsup 
Are the four witnesses the McCanns, Cat Baker and Charlotte Pennington? Why not five? Why not the visiting doctor who visited Kate to see if eeerrm I can't quite remember what he wanted now. But no matter, neither could he. 
So maybe Blacksmith thinks he wasn't really there? Thats a "credible" witness who places Madeleine alive at 6pm. Or was it 6.30? 7pm? Details details. 

The problem is Verdi, that when their claims are complete bullsh*t and back fitting, it becomes very difficult to argue against facts, so they resort to spewing vitriol on those they see as the leaders, Tony, Jill, Hideho and others such as Richard Hall.

But there are many members here who contribute to interesting and factual debate, yourself included, and one day it will all pay off thumbsup
I apologize profusely - off the top of my head I didn't include Richard D. Hall or PeterMac, who's had his fair share of vitriol overthe years.  There are probably others so forgive me if I've neglected anyone.

Would that be the missing doctor who paid that haunting visitation to Ms Healy, she enwrapped in towel, to check her credentials - either that or her pulse!

Yep, that's the usual form - can't come up with the goods so lash out with abuse.  Pathetic!

That is he, a man who struggled with the word towel. But hey, perhaps he was never there, like the illusive pimpernel.


OK so now I'm going to ask you to recollect what everybody was wearing. 

David Payne: I'm afraid that is, you know I'm, I cannot recall at all. You know that's, you'd think that was an obvious thing to remember. I cannot remember, as I say the, from the children point of view predominantly, I can remember the, you know, white, but I couldn't say exactly what they were wearing.... eeer 

Could you remember what Kate was wearing for example?

David Payne: I can't, no!
Shouldn't that be the illusive pimpleman smilie ?


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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by Verdi on 29.09.16 20:50

Okay folks, I've just been informed it's now official - the names of the mystery persons who witnessed Madeleine McCann's presence at high-tea on Thursday 3rd May 2007 are..

Catriona Baker
Charlotte Pennington
Emma Wilding
Jacqueline Williams
Kirsty Maryan
Lyndsey Johnson

Plenty pickings there open to scrutiny!

Haven't time now but later is another day..

ETA:  Don't wish to mislead - on reflection the list is more likely intended to indicate a living Madeleine during the whole week.

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by HiDeHo on 29.09.16 21:34

I see there is a further post
http://blacksmithbureau.blogspot.ca/2016/09/evidence-is-such-boring-stuff.html?m=1


It saddens me to see but I  won't respond to the comments thrown at me but I felt it is important to correct the accusations...



The title of the thread is 

 Re: Was Madeleine seen after Sunday? "No credible evidence that she was" 



I did not title the thread....




This was my comment used for the thread ....


@HiDeHo wrote:I CHALLENGE anyone to find a statement that could be considered PROOF that Madeleine was alive during the week... Was Madeleine seen after SUNDAY?

I did not come to the conclusion that something may have happened to her earlier in the week on a whim... I discovered some MAJOR discrepancies started happening on Tuesday and researched all the statements to try to pinpoint the day she was last seen... SUNDAY LUNCHTIME!

I have TWO VERY LONG threads collating some of the research. I don't 'guess' I worked hard to try to find ANYTHING that I considered proof... In 6 years or more, I have NEVER found anything...

Note: It doesn't mean she wasn't seen, but there is nothing to prove she was!

1) Title: People that saw Madeleine during the holiday
http://forum4.aimoo.com/madeleinemccanncontroversy/WELCOME-to-HDH-Controversy-Info/People-that-saw-Madeleine-during-the-holiday-1-2344234.html

2) Title: Did ANYONE see Madeleine during the holiday?
http://forum4.aimoo.com/madeleinemccanncontroversy/category/Did-ANYONE-see-Madeleine-during-the-holiday-1-2344239.html

https://www.facebook.com/groups/HiDeHoCONTROVERSYofMadeleineMcCann/permalink/527143374108823/

 I'm not saying there was evidence she wasn't seen and witnesses were lying... only that I see no PROOF.


Apart from Fatima I cannot conclude that ANY of their statements can be considered as proof.

The word 'evidence' is not something I used in my effort to find some kind of proof Madeleine was seen during the week.

There is no evidence she wasn't seen, but there is no PROOF she was!

I stand behind my findings unless someone can show me something that can be considered PROOF she was seen.

Lets also not forget the translated  rogatory statements were not received until mid June 2007, ONE MONTH before the case was shelved and not enough time for any of the more detailed comments to be scrutinised by the PJ.  



They are entered into the files but are not indexed and do not appear in files released to the public

The copies we see are from Duarte Levy.

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by Verdi on 29.09.16 23:23

@Google.Gaspar.Statements wrote:I wonder why he doesn't allow comments on his blog? winkwink
The same reason as those that do are very selective about what comments to publish smilie .

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Re: "Four witnesses confirm Madeleine was alive at 5.30pm on Thursday 3rd May - so, shut up anyone who thinks the evidence says otherwise" - Blacksmith and an especially vicious attack on Lizzy HideHo

Post by Verdi on 29.09.16 23:29

So there is no conclusive evidence or indication that Madeleine was seen at high-tea on Thursday 3rd May 2007 - the blog would appear to be ignoring the question by diverting the reader back to supposed evidence that a living Madeleine was around and about during the entire week.  Cunning, rather obvious but I'm quite willing to tackle that angle as well, which in turn will lead back to high-tea on Thursday.
 
The named witness statements were taken on the 6th/7th/8th of May 2007.  At that time there was nothing to suggest Madeleine's disappearance was in any way connected to the creche, the staff interviews therefore would have only been to get an idea of Madeleine's disposition and relationship with her parents.  The witness statements were not taken verbatim, the witnesses were clearly asked a series of fixed questions and answered accordingly - so far nothing unusual or suspicious in itself - however..

Alex Woolfall, Head of Issues and Crisis Management for the Bell Pottinger Group, was called in by the Mark Warner management team and by all accounts arrived at the Ocean Club on 4th May 2007 - two days prior to commencement of the creche staff formal interviews.  Just imagine it - whatever the true circumstances, a three year old child has disappeared (possibly abducted) from a Warner holiday complex, the corporations well established reputation for exemplary holiday childcare is suddenly in jeopardy.  Now what do Warners/Bell Pottinger/Alex Woolfall do?

I strongly suspect they went straight into PR mode, covering all angles to ensure their reputation wasn't damaged by this little inconvenience.  Priority focus security and childcare arrangements!  There is no doubt in my mind that the creche staff were briefed by the strong arm of PR prior to giving their witness statements  I make no accusations of lying at this stage, just a briefing on how to respond to the questions asked to protect the Mark Warner brand image.  That covers the witness statements named, in an attempt to prove Madeleine was alive throughout the entire week of 28th April-3rd May 2007.  Only it doesn't prove anything - it only shows an orchestrated PR management exercise.
 
This  misrepresentation of the truth in order to demolish all the hard work, thanks to CMoMM forum members, proves nothing.  So that out of the way, next - where is the evidence that Madeleine McCann was seen alive beyond doubt during that week culminating with the evidence that she was at high-tea on Thursday 3rd May 2007?

I'm still waiting...

waiting

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