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Blacksmith - So Unfair!

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by JRP on 29.07.16 20:35

@Verdi wrote:
@JRP wrote:
@kaz wrote:I don't know nearly as much about this case as do the regular posters but what I do know is that OG gave two completely different images for Smithman. Why would that be?

He looks exactly like this, or possibly more like this. 
Anyway, if you recognize him please give us a call. 
It all adds to the confusion.
They should have stuck with 'eggman' - more chance of finding a tribute act..




I am the eggman, they are the eggmen - I am the walrus, goo goo 

I think you're right. They're 'avin' a larf.

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by Tony Bennett on 29.07.16 20:36

@Verdi wrote:
@JRP wrote:
@kaz wrote:I don't know nearly as much about this case as do the regular posters but what I do know is that OG gave two completely different images for Smithman. Why would that be?

He looks exactly like this, or possibly more like this. 
Anyway, if you recognize him please give us a call. 
It all adds to the confusion.
They should have stuck with 'eggman' - more chance of finding a tribute act..




I am the eggman, they are the eggmen - I am the walrus, goo goo g'joob

Jane Tanner, 4 May 2007: "He didn't look like a tourist"

Nuno Lourenco (describing Wojcek Krokowski), 5 May: "He didn't look like a tourist"

Martin Smith, 16 and 26 May 2007: "He didn't look like a tourist"

DCI Andy Redwood, 14 October 2013: "He was a tourist. Ha Ha!"

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by Verdi on 29.07.16 20:36

The template for Tannerman and crecheman..



Acknowledgement -  Tony Bennett's diligence.

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by Verdi on 29.07.16 20:41

@Tony Bennett wrote:

DCI Andy Redwood, 14 October 2013: "He was a tourist. Ha Ha!"
laugh  Wondered who'd spot that first!

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by Verdi on 29.07.16 20:48

@willowthewisp wrote:Having read Blacksmith's posting article,He still is not clear as to what has happened to Madeleine McCann and her disappearance from the holiday apartment 5a Ocean Club,reported to GNR 3 May 2007?
Passive immunity either that or over inflated ego!  Come to think on it - maybe a combination of the two.

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by Verdi on 29.07.16 20:50

@Richard IV wrote:

Darned silly when everyone`s supposed to be working to the same end.
Strong emphasis on the word 'supposed'!

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by Verdi on 29.07.16 20:54

@April28th wrote:I never heard of this blog before now, but based on that odyssey of sophistry I don't think I'll be looking to read it again anytime soon.


It serves as a good homeopathic antidote for insomnia.

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by Verdi on 29.07.16 21:02

@JRP wrote:

Those pesky dogs make all the sightings complete bulls**t. So Redwood doesn't mention the dogs, and neither does Blacksmith.

Dogs don't lie, but people do. I'm with the dogs.
More transparent than the awning between the Tapas restaurant the piscine and Ocean Club apartment 5a.

If the deflectors don't completely ignore Eddie and Keela then they dive headlong into the absence of forensic corroboration.  Either way it amounts to the same thing - one thing for sure, it confirms their raison d'etre

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by Tony Bennett on 29.07.16 21:08

@Verdi wrote:The template for Tannerman and crecheman..



Goodness me, yes!!!

Cream-coloured jacket.

Longish black hair.

Mmm, about 5' 9" an' all, I reckon.  

And just look at those classic shoes!

Most definitely not a tourist, then!

Mind you, he wasn't wearing mustard chinos when Jane Tanner saw him. Or was that the effect of the weak orange neon lighting?

Within 10 days Jane Tanner's man had morphed into Robert Murat: "I'm sure it was him".

Or was the person who identified Murat actually a puppet made to look like Jane Tanner, with DCS Bob Small and two grey-suited blokes from Control Risks Group pulling the strings? "It was him". "I am sure". "It was him". "I am sure".

She was convincing. Murat was arrested the very next day.  

But seven months later when Melissa Little sketched Monsterman/George Harrison man, then she was sure that he was the man, not Murat.

They are playing us all for suckers with no brains.

Remind me, does Blacksmith think Smithman is real?

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by kaz on 29.07.16 21:09

And the big mystery of course: Why has 'Crecheman ' never been publically  identified? By all accounts he wasn't  doing anything illegal....................simply ferrying his own child around...............so why the reticence ? I'm surprised that Lorraine or Kirsty haven't had an 'exclusive' interview with him or the MOS , a  three page spread. The  media have made no attempt to find out more about him as far as I can see and since anything related to the Macs has a wonderful way of shifting newspapers, that makes me wonder why they missed the golden opportunity. Just running through the possibilities in my head:
If ' Crecheman'   was real, was he up to something he shouldn't have been? That would explain why he didn't come forward immediately  . Did he actually voluntarily finally come forward or was he 'found' by the  OG 'detectives? '
If he was a figment of Redwood's imagination it would obviously be to give some credence to Tanner's sighting and the fact that the description was very similar makes it seem likely. 'Smithman' would then become the  probable culprit but for all the reasons stated by others, it just isn't feasible that two men would be wandering around carrying a pyjama clad , shoeless three year old child with long blonde hair. Could 'Smithman'  have been' Crecheman?'  Well no, because Andy Redwood would have said so and not gone to the trouble of giving us two e fits for the man the Smiths allegedly saw.
IF both men were make believe to further the abduction story, why didn't Redwood link them? That would have been a smart move. Makes me think that the Smiths and Redwood were not working in unison here and both had their personal agendas .

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by Verdi on 29.07.16 23:40

@Tony Bennett wrote:

Within 10 days Jane Tanner's man had morphed into Robert Murat: "I'm sure it was him".

Hmmmm.. 

                  

            Tannerman                                      Muratman                                                  Harrisonman (the walrus)


                            

Well..... he doesn't look like a tourist sarcastic .

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by Grande Finale on 30.07.16 1:27

All irrevelant as the whole thread is within the bounds of the team Mccann set agenda ie 20.30pm to 22.00pm.

Over the years, it has become obvious that they attempted to move time foward by 24 hours, sometimes as much as 48 hours. All of this points to something having happened to Maddie on a much earlier day of the holiday.

Looking at Rob's eyewitness statement regarding the end of the creche on THAT Thursday he says....."I’m not entirely convinced now whether Madeleine was there or not"

Rob had gone to collect his daughter between 16.30 and 17.00 THAT afternoon, referring to the creche records shows us that just four children were signed in, so on collecting his daughter there SHOULD only have been 2 BOYS and MADDIE.......

Picture that for a moment, you collect your daughter and you don't notice whether or not you have left your friends daughter alone with just two boys. or there are just 2 children both boys left ??

Is this even possible ??
wouldn't his daughter have played most of the afternoon with the only other girl in the creche ? wouldn't they have been hugging kissing and waving to each other as one left ?

PS even pinpointing the collection time is damn nigh impossible 16.30 on the creche sheet but just before 17.00 according to Rob

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by pennylane on 30.07.16 10:28

I agree the McCanns have attempted to move the lengthy crying episode, as overheard by Mrs Fenn on 1st May, ahead 24 hours to evening of 2nd May, however the motive may not be because Maddie had already come to harm, it could be that the McCanns were at the Millennium on 1st and feared neglect charges. I personally believe Maddie was alive on 3rd and went to the beach with Cat Baker as claimed.

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by Grande Finale on 30.07.16 14:13

@pennylane wrote:I personally believe Maddie was alive on 3rd and went to the beach with Cat Baker as claimed.

On Thursday they sailed to the next beach. (10.00am to 11.00am)

On this day the sailed in a small yellow catamaran.

Employee Alice Standley accompanied the children during this sailing trip. Three children at a time would travel with each infant educator.

Employee Chris Unswork(UNSWORTH) transported the children, in a red amphibious dinghy, to the embarkation and a few minutes later, would return them to the beach and then pick up the remaining children.

It would be interesting to hear Alice Standley and Chris Unsworth corroborate this.


PS Wasn't this when Maddie was also playing football with Boyd junior


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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by Tony Bennett on 30.07.16 15:09

@ Grande Finale

The subject of Cat Baker's evidence is very well covered by HideHo in her various blogs and films, and was dealt with quite thoroughly by Richard Hall in this third documentary, 'When Madeleine Died?'  Basically both say her evidence is shot through with multiple contradiction and there's no basis for believing a word of it. I will deal with the evidence of Standley and Unsworth below, but first, a look at part of Cat Bake's rogatory.

Bear in mind that she makes this rogatory statement a year after the actual events and has had ample time to make her story 'fit' with the McCanns' account of events. Notably, she stayed with them in Rothley for a few days in November 2007. Some of the things she says in this statement are completely missing from, or contradict, what she first told the PJ:

EXTRACTS FROM CAT BAKER'S ROGATORY:

On Thursday the 3rd of May 2007, I remember Gerry having accompanied Madeleine to the club between 9h15 and 9h20 in the morning. I do not remember who came to pick her up for lunch but after, she returned in the afternoon for a dive/swim. These activities were realised with the other children. On this day I remember that we sailed and I saw friends of the McCanns on the beach, David and Jane. Around 14h45 Madeleine returned to the Minis Club on top of the reception but I do not remember who accompanied her. This afternoon we went swimming. Kate went to get Madeleine from the Tapas Bar area and according to what I remember she was wearing sporting clothes and I assumed that she was practising some form of athletics. It was around 15h25/18h00. I think that Gerry was playing tennis. 

I never noted anything strange in Madeleine's comportment during the time I stayed with her. There was one occasion, on Thursday, 3rd of May 2007, around 10H30 in the morning, where she cried at the launch of the yellow safety boat in the ocean where all the children were sailing. She was scared and fearful and cried on my lap "I am scared, I am scared." We only used the launches to transport the children to the small yellow boats. When we returned to the other boat she was happy again. She sailed in the small boat and even though some children had the opportunity to return to the port, she stayed for a second time [in the small boat]  as she appeared to be having a good time. Jane Tanner's daughter also took part in my group and together they would play. Apart from being a happy child in the club, she always seemed very content when she saw her parents. Madeleine did not demonstrate any fear with the return launch to land.

====

One Inspector Pinho walked to the beach with Cat Baker to check out her story.

He also spoke to Stadley and Unsworth and wrote this:

[quote from his report]

Alice Standley accompanied the children on the route and on the boat. Three children sailed with her

Chris Unsworth transported the children in a red amphibious boat (a life-saving boat) until the boat reached the open sea, and, a few minutes later, returned them to the beach to pick up three other children from the group.

=====


So, both these witnesses, according to Inspector Pinho, make no mention whatsoever of Cat Baker or anyone else going sailing with Madeleine’s group that morning.

They both add that they did not see anyone suspicious looking at the children or in the surrounding areas.

Neither, it appears, did either Alice Standley or Chris Unsworth say that Madeleine was in either of the boats of three children that went sailing that morning.

There were 7 children registered  in the Lobsters group.

On the Thursday, 3 May, only 6 children went sailing. Three in each boat. 

As for the Boyds' article, the First Magazine who published the article were quite definite: all the Boyd family wrote about happened, they say, on the WEDNESDAY. But no way does their article match either (a) what the McCann say about the Wednesay or (b) what the creche records say.

However, the way the article was written - everybody playing happily by the pool in the hot sunshine etc. etc. - looks like it was meant to prove that Madeleine was alive on the THURSDAY. But that doesn't work either, for lots of reasons, incuding (a) the weather was cloudy not sunny on Thursday (b) there were no water slides by the pool that week (c) the account completely contradicts what the McCanns say about that day and (d) once again, the Boyds' account conflicts with the crèche records.

All in all, the Boyds' article looks like one of the clumsiest efforts of all to try and prove that Madeleine was alive on either the Wednesday or the Thursday.

Again, Richard Hall covers this issue very thoroughly in his latest Madeleine documentary.

It seems like much more effort is now going on looking at events much earlier in the week and that therefore what is or is not supposed to have happened on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday looks increasingly irrelevant except perhaps simply counting up the sheer number of evasive and false statements being made about those days.

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by Grande Finale on 31.07.16 23:56

@ Tony

Hi and thanks for taking the time to reply Tony,

Yes I agree wholeheartedly that events earlier in the week should be looked at. I wonder if she was there after Monday personally, because they tried to say the tennis balls photo was from mini tennis on the Tuesday morning, when it is clearly NOT from a mini tennis session......

Anyhow whilst agreeing with the overall summary you gave, there are some mistakes....

1) A carefull look at the 3rd May morning lobster creche record shows 6 children signed in not 7 !

2) There WAS a water slide in existence I have posted a photo previously !

3) It was a SUNNY day on thursday 3rd VERY windy though with SOME cloud. Just look at the shorts and Tshirts the group who went to the beach were wearing at the Paraisio bar on the cctv.

I do think the last photograph was taken on the Sunday 29th though (that was a beautiful day with NO cloud)

I do believe the logic could be sound for an incident much earlier that week, BUT the TINY details are everything.

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by Tony Bennett on 01.08.16 8:10

@Grande Finale wrote:@ Tony

Hi and thanks for taking the time to reply Tony,

Yes I agree wholeheartedly that events earlier in the week should be looked at. I wonder if she was there after Monday personally, because they tried to say the tennis balls photo was from mini tennis on the Tuesday morning, when it is clearly NOT from a mini tennis session......

Anyhow whilst agreeing with the overall summary you gave, there are some mistakes....

1) A carefull look at the 3rd May morning lobster creche record shows 6 children signed in not 7 !

REPLY: I accept the correction. I think I'm right in saying that for the whole week, just 7 children were registered in 'Lobsters'. As for the SIX names you mention on the crèche sheet for Thursday 3 May, at all times we must remember that Catriona Baker was in sole charge of that crèche that week, we also must bear in mind that Jon Corner's daughter Chloe Corner had been a Facebook Friend of Cat Baker in 2006 and quite possible before, then there is the fact that Jon Corner said he was a 'regular visitor' to Praia da Luz before 2007, and finally there is the evident close friendship between Cat Baker and the McCanns to consider     

2) There WAS a water slide in existence I have posted a photo previously !

REPLY: I can't recall seeing that, but will take your word for it that that photo of a water slide was taken during the week 28 April to 3 May 2007. Are you able to re-post it please? Of course, Kate McCann herself in her book makes no mention of Louie Boyd kicking a football around with Madeleine for an hour. This was sheer, unadulterated fiction and fabrication by the Boyds and First Magazine  

3) It was a SUNNY day on thursday 3rd VERY windy though with SOME cloud. Just look at the shorts and Tshirts the group who went to the beach were wearing at the Paraisio bar on the cctv.

REPLY:  I was broadly correct in describing Thursday as a 'cloudy' day. I think if you look at all the statements, we can say this about the weather that day: "It was basically cloudy until about 4pm to 5pm, when the sun came out and the temperature rose". Hence the shorts that you mention. 
  
 
I do think the last photograph was taken on the Sunday 29th though (that was a beautiful day with NO cloud)

I do believe the logic could be sound for an incident much earlier that week, BUT the TINY details are everything.

REPLY: Amen, and I fully agree and thank you for the corrections

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by kaz on 01.08.16 10:02

Very easy to get confused. Catriona herself can't remember how many children were with her on the sail that day...................'' Madeleine and four or five other children...'' and yet she can remember that on the morning of the 3rd...................''On Thursday the 3rd of May 2007, I remember Gerry having accompanied Madeleine to the club between 9h15 and 9h20 in the morning.''  She was only five minutes out !

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by Nina on 01.08.16 11:57

@kaz wrote:Very easy to get confused. Catriona herself can't remember how many children were with her on the sail that day...................'' Madeleine and four or five other children...'' and yet she can remember that on the morning of the 3rd...................''On Thursday the 3rd of May 2007, I remember Gerry having accompanied Madeleine to the club between 9h15 and 9h20 in the morning.''  She was only five minutes out !
So as these poor children whilst walking with Sammy the Snake had been depleted by one from five to four she wouldn't have known as she thought there might have been four anyway.
aaagh

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Re: Blacksmith - So Unfair!

Post by Grande Finale on 01.08.16 13:55

Sorry, YOU are correct this is obviously from a later time as the picket fence has been added.



However I have NOW noticed on the playground photo that IT is actually a slide (Green steps, brown slide on the opposite side!)
In addition to this there is a blue and yellow slide behind that one, which could possibly have been moved to the small pool ?
(I have another photo from June 2007 showing 2 of the blue and yellow slides)

Just suggesting we should be careful about stating NO water slide and one MAY have been on the grass ?



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