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*** 17,410,742 Brits (52%) vote for BREXIT on "INDEPENDENCE DAY" *** (was: E.U. REFERENDUM - The state of the polls)

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How will you vote in the E.U. Referendum?

18% 18% 
[ 47 ]
79% 79% 
[ 209 ]
3% 3% 
[ 7 ]
0% 0% 
[ 3 ]
 
Total Votes : 266

Re: *** 17,410,742 Brits (52%) vote for BREXIT on "INDEPENDENCE DAY" *** (was: E.U. REFERENDUM - The state of the polls)

Post by plebgate on 05.08.16 10:38

@Roxyroo wrote:
@Verdi wrote:
@Hobs wrote:GMC - But the book mentions facts that aren't true.

If they aren't true, then they cannot be facts.


dance
They can when your name is McCann - same as specialist dogs can be proven unreliable when scientifically tested yes .


Facts like- loss of appetite being included in the action against Amaral....didn't stop them eating "the best risotto" with dear old Clement a few days after MBM "disappeared". !!!
Excellent point.  I really do not understand how so many contradictory things seem to be completely ignored time and again.

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Re: *** 17,410,742 Brits (52%) vote for BREXIT on "INDEPENDENCE DAY" *** (was: E.U. REFERENDUM - The state of the polls)

Post by Tony Bennett on 05.08.16 13:53

@plebgate wrote:
Facts like - loss of appetite being included in the action against Amaral....didn't stop them eating "the best risotto" with dear old Clement a few [weeks]  after MBM "disappeared". !!!
Excellent point.  I really do not understand how so many contradictory things seem to be completely ignored time and again.
Not to forget another incident which rather contradicts the bogus 'loss of appetite' claim, which occurred at a meeting between the McCanns and self-professed 'child sex expert and criminologist' Ray Wyre and his wife - see bit in red below.

This is from a long article I wrote way back on 10 October 2010: 'RAY WYRE AND THE MCCANNS: What was the connection between the McCanns and the late paedophilia ‘expert’, Ray Wyre?' - still available online somewhere I think.

Wyre has since been exposed as basically a pervert and of course his name also appears on the guest list of that 'Guest House of Shame' - Elm House.

My article, inter alia, quoted from an article in the Sunday People in January 2008:  

---------------

RAY WYRE AND THE MCCANNS

What was the connection between the McCanns and the late paedophilia ‘expert’, Ray Wyre?
by Tony Bennett, Secretary of The Madeleine Foundation
filed 10 October 2010

QUOTE:

EXCLUSIVE: MCCANNS ARE 'TOTALLY INNOCENT'
EXCLUSIVE TRUTH ABOUT THE McCANNS: BY TOP UK CRIME CRACKER 
The People  -  By Marcello Mega and Daniel Jones

Daniel.Jones@People.Co.Uk   27 January 2008

Kate and Gerry played NO part in the disappearance of their daughter Madeleine, one of the world's top crime experts declared last night.
Ray Wyre - who has given Cracker-style testimony to courts since the 1970s - said: “It is absolutely IMPOSSIBLE for them to have been involved”. He insisted the grief-stricken parents were incapable of doing anything to harm their children.

He told how the couple feared Maddie was dead in the hours after she vanished - the first time their initial anguish has been revealed. And he heaped scorn on claims the McCanns are being torn apart by the tragedy, adding: “They are a close and loving couple”.

Wyre spoke out as it was revealed Portuguese cops now believe four-year-old Maddie may have been abducted - as Kate and Gerry have always claimed. 

The couple met Wyre, 56, to discuss setting up an international taskforce to help cops trace missing children.
They poured out their hearts to him and his wife Charmaine over dinner at the ace criminologists's home in Milton Keynes, Bucks.

Wyre - who's helped nail a string of monsters including child-killer Robert Black - said: "I was with them for several hours and I could not help but apply some of the practices I use when I'm carrying out assessments of suspects for police and the courts.

“I can state categorically there is no way they were involved in their daughter's murder or disappearance. They would be incapable of such an act. I have more than 30 years' experience in this field and am used to people trying to hide dark secrets.

“There was NO sign of any such deceit. It is absolutely impossible for them to have been involved”.

And Wyre paid a moving tribute to the way the 39-year-old couple manage to think of other people even though their hearts are broken.
He said: “It was humbling and moving to meet the McCanns. They brought flowers for my wife, which brought tears to our eyes. You consider what they've been through and they still bring flowers when they come to your home”.

Wyre hit out at shocking claims of eating disorders and marriage rifts made about Kate and heart specialist Gerry, whose twins Sean and Amelie have just turned three.

He said: “It can't have helped while they've had this massive tragedy on their hands. Days before we met I was reading an ill-informed article saying they were growing apart. But they are a close and loving couple who are certainly united in their roles of being good parents to the twins and maintaining momentum in their quest to find Madeleine.

“There is no doubt they are a couple - they are together and they support and comfort one another. They were very warm and friendly to each other and there was no sign of dispute between them. During the meal, Gerry often put his arm round the back of Kate's chair. They were affectionate to one another all the time. They looked very much together. As for any suggestion Kate might have an eating disorder, it's nonsense. She sat down to my wife's home-made lasagne and garlic bread with a smile and really enjoyed it. And she tucked into the banoffee pie for pudding like the rest of us”. 
 


[Rest of article snipped]

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Re: *** 17,410,742 Brits (52%) vote for BREXIT on "INDEPENDENCE DAY" *** (was: E.U. REFERENDUM - The state of the polls)

Post by sar on 06.08.16 22:44

@Tony Bennett wrote:
@plebgate wrote:
Facts like - loss of appetite being included in the action against Amaral....didn't stop them eating "the best risotto" with dear old Clement a few [weeks]  after MBM "disappeared". !!!
Excellent point.  I really do not understand how so many contradictory things seem to be completely ignored time and again.
Not to forget another incident which rather contradicts the bogus 'loss of appetite' claim, which occurred at a meeting between the McCanns and self-professed 'child sex expert and criminologist' Ray Wyre and his wife - see bit in red below.

This is from a long article I wrote way back on 10 October 2010: 'RAY WYRE AND THE MCCANNS: What was the connection between the McCanns and the late paedophilia ‘expert’, Ray Wyre?' - still available online somewhere I think.

Wyre has since been exposed as basically a pervert and of course his name also appears on the guest list of that 'Guest House of Shame' - Elm House.

My article, inter alia, quoted from an article in the Sunday People in January 2008:  

---------------

RAY WYRE AND THE MCCANNS

What was the connection between the McCanns and the late paedophilia ‘expert’, Ray Wyre?
by Tony Bennett, Secretary of The Madeleine Foundation
filed 10 October 2010

QUOTE:

EXCLUSIVE: MCCANNS ARE 'TOTALLY INNOCENT'
EXCLUSIVE TRUTH ABOUT THE McCANNS: BY TOP UK CRIME CRACKER 
The People  -  By Marcello Mega and Daniel Jones

Daniel.Jones@People.Co.Uk   27 January 2008

Kate and Gerry played NO part in the disappearance of their daughter Madeleine, one of the world's top crime experts declared last night.
Ray Wyre - who has given Cracker-style testimony to courts since the 1970s - said: “It is absolutely IMPOSSIBLE for them to have been involved”. He insisted the grief-stricken parents were incapable of doing anything to harm their children.

He told how the couple feared Maddie was dead in the hours after she vanished - the first time their initial anguish has been revealed. And he heaped scorn on claims the McCanns are being torn apart by the tragedy, adding: “They are a close and loving couple”.

Wyre spoke out as it was revealed Portuguese cops now believe four-year-old Maddie may have been abducted - as Kate and Gerry have always claimed. 

The couple met Wyre, 56, to discuss setting up an international taskforce to help cops trace missing children.
They poured out their hearts to him and his wife Charmaine over dinner at the ace criminologists's home in Milton Keynes, Bucks.

Wyre - who's helped nail a string of monsters including child-killer Robert Black - said: "I was with them for several hours and I could not help but apply some of the practices I use when I'm carrying out assessments of suspects for police and the courts.

“I can state categorically there is no way they were involved in their daughter's murder or disappearance. They would be incapable of such an act. I have more than 30 years' experience in this field and am used to people trying to hide dark secrets.

“There was NO sign of any such deceit. It is absolutely impossible for them to have been involved”.

And Wyre paid a moving tribute to the way the 39-year-old couple manage to think of other people even though their hearts are broken.
He said: “It was humbling and moving to meet the McCanns. They brought flowers for my wife, which brought tears to our eyes. You consider what they've been through and they still bring flowers when they come to your home”.

Wyre hit out at shocking claims of eating disorders and marriage rifts made about Kate and heart specialist Gerry, whose twins Sean and Amelie have just turned three.

He said: “It can't have helped while they've had this massive tragedy on their hands. Days before we met I was reading an ill-informed article saying they were growing apart. But they are a close and loving couple who are certainly united in their roles of being good parents to the twins and maintaining momentum in their quest to find Madeleine.

“There is no doubt they are a couple - they are together and they support and comfort one another. They were very warm and friendly to each other and there was no sign of dispute between them. During the meal, Gerry often put his arm round the back of Kate's chair. They were affectionate to one another all the time. They looked very much together. As for any suggestion Kate might have an eating disorder, it's nonsense. She sat down to my wife's home-made lasagne and garlic bread with a smile and really enjoyed it. And she tucked into the banoffee pie for pudding like the rest of us”. 
 


[Rest of article snipped]
Lasagne and garlic bread washed down with banoffee pie!  The height of good taste, a bit like New Zealand wine.  Lip smackin'ly good, so tasty, so wholesome!!!  Bleurch!!!  [Reaches for the vomiting emoji]

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17,410,742 vote out

Post by willowthewisp on 07.08.16 15:58

So Genius Marc Carney lowers the savings rate to 0.25%, which will in effect all of the Pension holders,through lower long term savings Bonds?
So he begins a new process of QE for his Bank Chums in the hope UK to not go into a recession?
So former QE was issued to the Banks and they kept hold of the funds and turned bad debts into future derivatives investments,long term plans now resold to the "New Investors" who now realise they bought a "PUP", that now have to pay exit charges of 25 % on their portfolios, forcing the Governor to provide more QE stimulus for the Banks and not Industry?
So if your a saver and have not got any outstanding loans,Mortgage etc,you've been shafted for the past Eight years with such poor interest rates paid to them, whilst the Bank made vast profits on the money you had held in these Banks,by lending to fund over spending Credit card holders,who have created this crisis by giving them the "Credit Cards",the Banks?
The Pound has recovered, the Footsie is up,yet the genius is printing money,QE in fear of a recession,isn't a recession based on the"Stock Market" when it falls, not when it's stable near a 7000 mark?

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Re: *** 17,410,742 Brits (52%) vote for BREXIT on "INDEPENDENCE DAY" *** (was: E.U. REFERENDUM - The state of the polls)

Post by BlueBag on 07.08.16 16:31

In times of debt you need public investment and job creation.

Preferably full employment.

That way you get more tax in less benefits out.

In the good times you pay back the debts - it is during this part of the cycle you trim back and pay off the debts.

The reason we don't get get this is that the closer to full employment we get the more power is in the hands of the workers who can say "stuff this... i'm off down the road" and there is competition among corporations to attract workers using better wages and conditions. This is a fairer method for distribution of wealth.

Unemployment is pure Thatcheristic control of the workers.

Austerity is a nonsense - it creates more debt.

Democracy is an insurance policy for the rich and they have been skimping on the payments for some time now.

It's not going to be pretty for them at some point.

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17,410,742 vote out

Post by willowthewisp on 08.08.16 13:25

Hi Bluebag,Our family was brought up in the 1950' to 1960's and it was instilled into us at an early age that you saved up to pay cash for the products you wanted to buy and only sought credit for essential transport/Motor Cycles to ensure you could get to a place of work miles away from public transport system.
Credit is fine if you can pay back the loan and the interest,but it becomes a problem when,"Banks" offer bigger credit options, which lead to more cards,upon cards and just like a "Pyramid" card stack it finally collapses?
What has changed is the"Mentality"of buying on the never,never,it's never yours until you have paid for it?
It maybe a bygone age,but people who did not have a washing machine,hired one on a weekly basis to have essentials cleaned to wear for the family,the washer man,used to repair his Washers, but nowadays we live in a"Throw away Society" instead of a make do and mend attitude with"Easy Finance" Crazy George,Wonga of over 1000's of percent interest PA, talk about educating the masses?
Kids today laugh, when you tell them of how you had to get of your **se to turn the TV channel over up or alter the volume,colour and only had three channels to watch,imagine that today,having to get of your **se hundreds of times a day to turn the TV channel over, couldn't be called a couch potato then?

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Re: *** 17,410,742 Brits (52%) vote for BREXIT on "INDEPENDENCE DAY" *** (was: E.U. REFERENDUM - The state of the polls)

Post by Verdi on 08.08.16 19:57

@willowthewisp wrote:
So Genius Marc Carney lowers the savings rate to 0.25%, which will in effect all of the Pension holders,through lower long term savings Bonds?
So he begins a new process of QE for his Bank Chums in the hope UK to not go into a recession?
So former QE was issued to the Banks and they kept hold of the funds and turned bad debts into future derivatives investments,long term plans now resold to the "New Investors" who now realise they bought a "PUP", that now have to pay exit charges of 25 % on their portfolios, forcing the Governor to provide more QE stimulus for the Banks and not Industry?
So if your a saver and have not got any outstanding loans,Mortgage etc,you've been shafted for the past Eight years with such poor interest rates paid to them, whilst the Bank made vast profits on the money you had held in these Banks,by lending to fund over spending Credit card holders,who have created this crisis by giving them the "Credit Cards",the Banks?
The Pound has recovered, the Footsie is up,yet the genius is printing money,QE in fear of a recession,isn't a recession based on the"Stock Market" when it falls, not when it's stable near a 7000 mark?
I think the banks forget they are only custodians of our money - in effect our money is on loan.  So, they borrow our money, invest it making millions for themselves in the process and expect us to pay for the privilege.  Is that inverted logic or fuzzy logic?

Now here's a radical notion - drastically cut-down on management and administrative costs;  stop sending out glossy brochures to customers every five minutes to explain banking procedural changes that go straight in the bin;  reduce the millions spent on flashy offices to accommodate staff;  totally cut-out the ridiculous annual bonus payments to staff....

In short - earn yer blooming living like the rest of us have to and stop coveting and feasting on our money.

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The secret of life is honesty and fair dealing. If you can fake that, you've got it made" - Groucho Marx

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Re: *** 17,410,742 Brits (52%) vote for BREXIT on "INDEPENDENCE DAY" *** (was: E.U. REFERENDUM - The state of the polls)

Post by BlueBag on 08.08.16 21:17

@Verdi wrote:

I think the banks forget they are only custodians of our money - in effect our money is on loan.  So, they borrow our money, invest it making millions for themselves in the process and expect us to pay for the privilege.  Is that inverted logic or fuzzy logic?
Verdi,

Sadly the reverse is true.

The banks create money out of thin air then lend it to us with interest.

It is impossible for the money to be paid back plus the interest because the total debt in the system doesn't equal the actual money.

Bank: I create £100, pay me back £110.

Lender: Where does the extra £10 come from?

Bank; Ah ha!

However, the banks are happy to take physical assets (real unchanging wealth) in lieu.

Note: See Greece.

It's been a scam for centuries - since the days of William of Orange... at least... well actually usury is a much older sin outlawed in the Bible...

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Re: *** 17,410,742 Brits (52%) vote for BREXIT on "INDEPENDENCE DAY" *** (was: E.U. REFERENDUM - The state of the polls)

Post by BlueBag on 08.08.16 21:38

@God wrote:
Exodus 22:24 (25)—If thou lend money to any of My people, even to the poor with thee, thou shalt not be to him as a creditor; neither shall ye lay upon him interest.
Leviticus 25:36— Take thou no interest of him or increase; but fear thy God; that thy brother may live with thee.
Leviticus 25:37— Thou shalt not give him thy money upon interest, nor give him thy victuals for increase.
Deuteronomy 23:20 (19)—Thou shalt not lend upon interest to thy brother: interest of money, interest of victuals, interest of any thing that is lent upon interest.
Deuteronomy 23:21 (20)—Unto a foreigner thou mayest lend upon interest; but unto thy brother thou shalt not lend upon interest; that the LORD thy God may bless thee in all that thou puttest thy hand unto, in the land whither thou goest in to possess it.
Ezekiel 18:17—that hath withdrawn his hand from the poor, that hath not received interest nor increase, hath executed Mine ordinances, hath walked in My statutes; he shall not die for the iniquity of his father, he shall surely live.
Psalm 15:5—He that putteth not out his money on interest, nor taketh a bribe against the innocent. He that doeth these things shall never be moved.

Why do Jews and Christians ignore what their god has told them?

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17,410,742 vote out

Post by willowthewisp on 09.08.16 13:37

@BlueBag wrote:
@God wrote:
Exodus 22:24 (25)—If thou lend money to any of My people, even to the poor with thee, thou shalt not be to him as a creditor; neither shall ye lay upon him interest.
Leviticus 25:36— Take thou no interest of him or increase; but fear thy God; that thy brother may live with thee.
Leviticus 25:37— Thou shalt not give him thy money upon interest, nor give him thy victuals for increase.
Deuteronomy 23:20 (19)—Thou shalt not lend upon interest to thy brother: interest of money, interest of victuals, interest of any thing that is lent upon interest.
Deuteronomy 23:21 (20)—Unto a foreigner thou mayest lend upon interest; but unto thy brother thou shalt not lend upon interest; that the LORD thy God may bless thee in all that thou puttest thy hand unto, in the land whither thou goest in to possess it.
Ezekiel 18:17—that hath withdrawn his hand from the poor, that hath not received interest nor increase, hath executed Mine ordinances, hath walked in My statutes; he shall not die for the iniquity of his father, he shall surely live.
Psalm 15:5—He that putteth not out his money on interest, nor taketh a bribe against the innocent. He that doeth these things shall never be moved.

Why do Jews and Christians ignore what their god has told them?
They must be the Bankers then?

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Re: *** 17,410,742 Brits (52%) vote for BREXIT on "INDEPENDENCE DAY" *** (was: E.U. REFERENDUM - The state of the polls)

Post by aquila on 09.08.16 13:46

@willowthewisp wrote:
@BlueBag wrote:
@God wrote:
Exodus 22:24 (25)—If thou lend money to any of My people, even to the poor with thee, thou shalt not be to him as a creditor; neither shall ye lay upon him interest.
Leviticus 25:36— Take thou no interest of him or increase; but fear thy God; that thy brother may live with thee.
Leviticus 25:37— Thou shalt not give him thy money upon interest, nor give him thy victuals for increase.
Deuteronomy 23:20 (19)—Thou shalt not lend upon interest to thy brother: interest of money, interest of victuals, interest of any thing that is lent upon interest.
Deuteronomy 23:21 (20)—Unto a foreigner thou mayest lend upon interest; but unto thy brother thou shalt not lend upon interest; that the LORD thy God may bless thee in all that thou puttest thy hand unto, in the land whither thou goest in to possess it.
Ezekiel 18:17—that hath withdrawn his hand from the poor, that hath not received interest nor increase, hath executed Mine ordinances, hath walked in My statutes; he shall not die for the iniquity of his father, he shall surely live.
Psalm 15:5—He that putteth not out his money on interest, nor taketh a bribe against the innocent. He that doeth these things shall never be moved.

Why do Jews and Christians ignore what their god has told them?
They must be the Bankers then?
It's called mammon. It's nothing new to human nature.

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Re: *** 17,410,742 Brits (52%) vote for BREXIT on "INDEPENDENCE DAY" *** (was: E.U. REFERENDUM - The state of the polls)

Post by Tony Bennett on 09.08.16 21:43

@BlueBag wrote:
@God wrote:
Exodus 22:24 (25)—If thou lend money to any of My people, even to the poor with thee, thou shalt not be to him as a creditor; neither shall ye lay upon him interest.
Leviticus 25:36— Take thou no interest of him or increase; but fear thy God; that thy brother may live with thee.
Leviticus 25:37— Thou shalt not give him thy money upon interest, nor give him thy victuals for increase.
Deuteronomy 23:20 (19)—Thou shalt not lend upon interest to thy brother: interest of money, interest of victuals, interest of any thing that is lent upon interest.
Deuteronomy 23:21 (20)—Unto a foreigner thou mayest lend upon interest; but unto thy brother thou shalt not lend upon interest; that the LORD thy God may bless thee in all that thou puttest thy hand unto, in the land whither thou goest in to possess it.
Ezekiel 18:17—that hath withdrawn his hand from the poor, that hath not received interest nor increase, hath executed Mine ordinances, hath walked in My statutes; he shall not die for the iniquity of his father, he shall surely live.
Psalm 15:5—He that putteth not out his money on interest, nor taketh a bribe against the innocent. He that doeth these things shall never be moved.

Why do Jews and Christians ignore what their god has told them?
@ BlueBag       This was an off-topic challenge and if I answered you on this thread I would also be off-topic.

So I have answered you in the Members' Lounge, here:  

http://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t13051-an-answer-to-bluebag-on-the-old-testament-prohibition-of-the-practice-of-usury#347627



THiu

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                            "Maddie's Jammies. Where is Maddie?" - Amelie, May 2007 -  "Maddie's Jammies. Where is Maddie?"


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