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Amber Peat (13) is missing.

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by Nowool on 04.06.15 11:39

Genuine question..... have the police confirmed it was suicide? To my knowledge the only details are that the poor girl was found hanged. I'm aware the police initially said they weren't treating the death as suspicious but I don't think that can be taken as read until the autopsy/corners report is in.

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by Joss on 04.06.15 11:54

@Nowool wrote:Genuine question..... have the police confirmed it was suicide? To my knowledge the only details are that the poor girl was found hanged. I'm aware the police initially said they weren't treating the death as suspicious but I don't think that can be taken as read until the autopsy/corners report is in.

Missing girl Amber Peat died by hanging, police say
Nottinghamshire police say they are not treating death as suspicious after body discovered on Tuesday night close to girl’s home



http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/jun/03/amber-peat-death-hanging-police

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by BlueBag on 04.06.15 12:28

@Tony Bennett wrote:The Inquest, above all, will be the place to explore the sequence of events that led to her death.
Unless it's like the Brenda Leyland one.

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by Guest on 04.06.15 12:45

@Benion wrote:
Ladyinred wrote:Her sad death is rooted in the family dynamics, IMO.

Please quit doing this as I find it offensive as a relative of a suicide victim. As I have said suicide is just that. A tragic choice. I have no doubt there are a myriad of contributory factors, but to attempt to lay the blame on one or more people is wrong.
That is my opinion on the topic being discussed here.  

I am sorry to hear of your own family loss.

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by Joss on 04.06.15 12:50

@BlueBag wrote:
@Tony Bennett wrote:The Inquest, above all, will be the place to explore the sequence of events that led to her death.
Unless it's like the Brenda Leyland one.
What reason would they have to cover up a teenage suicide? As far as i know Amber Peat was in no way linked to the McCann case.

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by jeanmonroe on 04.06.15 13:00

(Admin: delete if already 'posted')

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-33003810

Amber Peat murder claim Facebook post prompts police probe

27 minutes ago

Amber was described as a "bright" girl by her school's principal

A social media post that falsely claimed missing Nottinghamshire schoolgirl Amber Peat had been murdered is being investigated by police.

Amber, 13, went missing from her Mansfield home on Saturday evening and her body was found on Tuesday evening.

A Facebook post, which claimed it was not worth searching for her because she had been murdered, was seen at about this time, officers confirmed.

Police have confirmed Amber's death is not being treated as suspicious.

A spokesman said: "We are aware of an offensive Facebook post which was seen yesterday evening by many people supporting our efforts to find missing Amber Peat.

Police said the body would not have been visible from a nearby busy road and footpath

"We would like to let the public know we are robustly investigating and will work hard to bring to justice anyone who publishes such appalling posts to social media."

The force declined to confirm the exact wording of the post, but it is believed to have carried graphic details of a violent attack.

Amber went missing after what her parents described as a minor row about chores.

Hundreds of people volunteered to help with the search and posters were put in shops, house windows and on lamp posts.

Her body was found in a small patch of woodland, close to roads and housing, by a dog walker.

The cause of death has been confirmed as hanging.
-------------------------------------------------------

Just 'one' thing:

It was 'said' that two police officers 'found' Amber, NOT a 'dog walker'

REF: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-32996179

'Out of sight'

Supt McFarlane said her body was found by two officers searching an area off Westfield Lane.

He said in a statement the body was "out of sight" and would not have been apparent to anyone in the area nearby.

An officer at the scene had earlier told the BBC the area had previously been searched.
--------------------------
just 'saying'

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by BlueBag on 04.06.15 13:03

@Joss wrote:
@BlueBag wrote:
@Tony Bennett wrote:The Inquest, above all, will be the place to explore the sequence of events that led to her death.
Unless it's like the Brenda Leyland one.
What reason would they have to cover up a teenage suicide? As far as i know Amber Peat was in no way linked to the McCann case.
Who said cover up?

A minimalist inquest is the word.

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by jeanmonroe on 04.06.15 13:13

JEEEEZ!

NOT 'everything' (although they'd like it to be) is 'connected' to the bloody McCanns!

They are NOT 'the centre of the universe'!

They ARE two, self confessed, lying, neglegent, irresponsible 'parents' of a child, ONLY THEY have 'said' was 'abducted'!

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by mysterion on 04.06.15 13:28

....  and according to Kate it was carried out by more than one person. How can she possibly know that?

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by Joss on 04.06.15 13:31

@BlueBag wrote:
@Joss wrote:
@BlueBag wrote:
@Tony Bennett wrote:The Inquest, above all, will be the place to explore the sequence of events that led to her death.
Unless it's like the Brenda Leyland one.
What reason would they have to cover up a teenage suicide? As far as i know Amber Peat was in no way linked to the McCann case.
Who said cover up?

A minimalist inquest is the word.
No problem, my bad for thinking you were inferring such. I think there was a theory of sorts about BL's death and consequent inquest that it was being covered for something a bit more sinister than an outright suicide, if my memory serves me. Assisted suicide was one of the theories back then that i read around the net.

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by Joss on 04.06.15 13:33

@jeanmonroe wrote:JEEEEZ!

NOT 'everything' (although they'd like it to be) is 'connected' to the bloody McCanns!

They are NOT 'the centre of the universe'!

They ARE two, self confessed, lying, neglegent, irresponsible 'parents' of a child, ONLY THEY have 'said' was 'abducted'!
ITA, the McC's are dead beat parents IMO from what we know of them via their own words.

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by Dee75 on 04.06.15 13:49

On the subject of caravans.  There are several parks in the Holywell Bay area that have caravans with roof tiles.  The link below is of such a caravan from the Holywell Bay area, however I am not saying that this is the caravan site the family used.

http://holywellholidaypark.co.uk/caravans

Going by a photograph of Danny and Kelly's wedding (Iwon't post it here for obvious reasons) they have 2/3 girls and I believe Danny has 1 boy which may or may not be Kelly's son.
In the photograph the family are all smiling, that is apart from Amber who seems to look distant.  Again there may be many reasons for this or it may be the photographer took it at the precise moment Amber stopped smiling.

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by j.rob on 04.06.15 14:07

@Cloud78 wrote:
@Nowool wrote:It all seems fishy to me. As soon as I saw the plea the step dad seemed to be flustered and hiding something. As another poster mentioned, the laughing comment struck a chord with me. Miserable photos coupled with her being found hanged (no confirmation of her having hanged herself as yet) do not fit with the image he is trying to deliver of a girl who never stopped laughing on holiday. Someone sent me this on twitter, it down go to prove anything but another ominous sign all was not right in poor Ambers life. http://m.derbytelegraph.co.uk/Owner-let-rabbit-starve-death-hutch-outside/story-13118547-detail/story.html

Wow.. this makes sense..
So this is a case of:
An unemployed stepfather + who lied on authorities for money (so he is a proffesional lier) + who has a history of mistreaing pets + hanged child..
could all that be "unsuspicious"?

There is "absolutely no way" as Gerry McCann might say that this death could fall into the category of "unsuspicious" at this early stage, imo.

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by j.rob on 04.06.15 14:30

Nottinghamshire Police have confirmed that the cause of death was hanging and said her death is not being treated as suspicious. However, it said it was investigating an "appalling" post on social media that had been seen by many people who had helped in the search. Police refused to discuss the exact wording of the post, but the BBC says the Facebook message claimed it was not worth searching for Amber because she had been murdered. A couple of newspapers said the "internet troll" went into "graphic detail" about the fictional murder in the post, which was published just minutes after her body was found.
A spokesman for Nottinghamshire Police said: "We are aware of an offensive Facebook post which was seen yesterday evening by many people supporting our efforts to find missing Amber Peat.
"We would like to let the public know we are robustly investigating and will work hard to bring to justice anyone who publishes such appalling posts to social media."


Read more: http://www.theweek.co.uk/63851/amber-peat-police-dismiss-gameof72-link-in-missing-girl-case#ixzz3c6EQi06k

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by comperedna on 04.06.15 15:21

This seemingly genuinely sick character - 'sick troll' so called in the MSM - made up a whole load of violent fantasy rubbish about how he had murdered poor Amber Peat soon after she went missing and, so we are told, put the horrible false details on Facebook. What gets me is that this person, now sought by the police, is called the same thing in the press as anyone who is a tad skeptical about the current official line about what happened to Madeleine McCann! What a rubbish popular press we do have in the UK!

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by BlueBag on 04.06.15 16:21

We'll see if anything comes of this "sick troll".

It could be part of the problem-reaction-solution game.

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by jeanmonroe on 04.06.15 16:23

If, IF, 'say' someone 'called' erm, Jerry McCann, sarcastically, or maybe 'truthfully'(?), posted on Facebook, 'saying'..."yeah, yeah, i know, Kate killed her (Madeleine) in a frenzy..." would the police devote 'resources' into bringing 'him' to justice?

Would the msm be calling 'him' a 'sick troll'?

thinking

Oh, hang on, a 'jerry' McCann DID 'say' THAT! (in 2008.)



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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by Benion on 04.06.15 16:49

Ladyinred wrote:
@Benion wrote:
Ladyinred wrote:Her sad death is rooted in the family dynamics, IMO.

Please quit doing this as I find it offensive as a relative of a suicide victim. As I have said suicide is just that. A tragic choice. I have no doubt there are a myriad of contributory factors, but to attempt to lay the blame on one or more people is wrong.
That is my opinion on the topic being discussed here.  

I am sorry to hear of your own family loss.

I know it is your opinion and for what it is worth neither me nor my uncle come from what could be described as a "normal, happy family". In fact I am still in therapy trying to come to terms with the type of individuals I happen to be related to. 

I just feel a little bit uncomfortable trying to blame people.

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by lj on 04.06.15 17:05

@ChippyM wrote:
@nomendelta wrote:
@ChippyM wrote:That's quite shocking for a 13 year old to even contemplate that. RIP.

It is shocking however it's not that uncommon - every so often a story pops up in the news be it a 13 year old, a 12 year old...even a 10 year old. I can only surmise that everything is so intense at that age, there's no shades of grey only black and white and things that don't matter really matter.

I regularly contemplated it myself from about 14 onwards for a while, but I had an extremely unhappy home life at the time with a psycho stepfather and an unhinged mother. Not saying that is the case here, just that I can relate to situations arising where someone so young would contemplate it.

 Yes I agree about depression being common in children and teens. I was seriously depressed at 14 too and most adults (even your parents) think it's just a teenage thing...or that it's for attention. It is clinical depression if you feel suicidal.  I also think it's feasible that in this case the parents thought she was just a 'moody teenager' and was OK.

  I suppose the thing that I found shocking was the method used if you see what I mean, so quick and brutal for a girl.  I don't know the statistics but I would imagine that most female suicide attempts use other methods.


Hanging is certainly not uncommon for suicides in young women. I heard it once explain by a survivor that it has something "romantic". She had her idea from a novel.
http://www.suicide.org/suicide-statistics.html

the numbers are a bit older, but this is a pattern seen for many years.


Clinical depression is also called major depression, you don't have to be suicidal.

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http://whatreallyhappenedtomadeleinemccann.blogspot.co.uk/

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by Guest on 04.06.15 19:41

@Benion wrote:
Ladyinred wrote:
@Benion wrote:
Ladyinred wrote:Her sad death is rooted in the family dynamics, IMO.

Please quit doing this as I find it offensive as a relative of a suicide victim. As I have said suicide is just that. A tragic choice. I have no doubt there are a myriad of contributory factors, but to attempt to lay the blame on one or more people is wrong.
That is my opinion on the topic being discussed here.  

I am sorry to hear of your own family loss.

I know it is your opinion and for what it is worth neither me nor my uncle come from what could be described as a "normal, happy family". In fact I am still in therapy trying to come to terms with the type of individuals I happen to be related to. 

I just feel a little bit uncomfortable trying to blame people.

Benion, I am not blaming anyone, I am referring to family dynamics and we are discussing Amber Peat, not any individual members of this forum.

I too did not have a "normal, happy family", and I know there are other members here who also did not.

I would like to end our exchange, and send my best wishes to you.

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by j.rob on 06.06.15 9:48

@PeterMac wrote:Death was by hanging.
RIP
What monsters were tormenting you ?


I'd put my bet that the torment in her life was, unfortunately, centered around the adults in her life in particular I would suspect the stepfather.

This poor girl was probably put in a highly vulnerable situation when her mother got into a relationship and remarried. The stepfather/daughter relationship can be extremely difficult even in the best of hands. I note that the stepfather has a prosecution for animal cruelty. This is nearly always a massive red flag in terms of a person's propensity to cruel and sadistic behaviour in general. This can be physical, emotional, psychological or a combination of these. Of course the latter two are very difficult to spot, especially if the perpetrator of the cruelty is clever and manipulative. 

The type of fragmented family set-up that this child was put in  can be an absolute minefield for sensitive and vulnerable children and teenagers - or indeed any child or teenager - and there is not nearly enough awareness of the need for children who might be at risk to be closely watched and given empathy and support and guidance.

This is truly such a sad case and it is really just the tip of a giant ice-berg. So very, very sad. But I would be amazed if a closer look at the family dynamic and background would not reveal a host of clues as to what ultimately made this child so unhappy that she took her own life. 

Quite often in these cases it appears to be to do with bullying from other children. But of course bullying can also be from adults and this is likely to be much more insidious and covert.

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by Guest on 06.06.15 9:58

agree

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by Joss on 06.06.15 13:28

@j.rob wrote:
@PeterMac wrote:Death was by hanging.
RIP
What monsters were tormenting you ?


I'd put my bet that the torment in her life was, unfortunately, centered around the adults in her life in particular I would suspect the stepfather.

This poor girl was probably put in a highly vulnerable situation when her mother got into a relationship and remarried. The stepfather/daughter relationship can be extremely difficult even in the best of hands. I note that the stepfather has a prosecution for animal cruelty. This is nearly always a massive red flag in terms of a person's propensity to cruel and sadistic behaviour in general. This can be physical, emotional, psychological or a combination of these. Of course the latter two are very difficult to spot, especially if the perpetrator of the cruelty is clever and manipulative. 

The type of fragmented family set-up that this child was put in  can be an absolute minefield for sensitive and vulnerable children and teenagers - or indeed any child or teenager - and there is not nearly enough awareness of the need for children who might be at risk to be closely watched and given empathy and support and guidance.

This is truly such a sad case and it is really just the tip of a giant ice-berg. So very, very sad. But I would be amazed if a closer look at the family dynamic and background would not reveal a host of clues as to what ultimately made this child so unhappy that she took her own life. 

Quite often in these cases it appears to be to do with bullying from other children. But of course bullying can also be from adults and this is likely to be much more insidious and covert.
goodpost j.rob, and what you say is very true. A lot of kids do have problems adapting to a step parent.

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by Benion on 06.06.15 15:21

@j.rob wrote:
@PeterMac wrote:Death was by hanging.
RIP
What monsters were tormenting you ?


I'd put my bet that the torment in her life was, unfortunately, centered around the adults in her life in particular I would suspect the stepfather.

This poor girl was probably put in a highly vulnerable situation when her mother got into a relationship and remarried. The stepfather/daughter relationship can be extremely difficult even in the best of hands. I note that the stepfather has a prosecution for animal cruelty. This is nearly always a massive red flag in terms of a person's propensity to cruel and sadistic behaviour in general. This can be physical, emotional, psychological or a combination of these. Of course the latter two are very difficult to spot, especially if the perpetrator of the cruelty is clever and manipulative. 

The type of fragmented family set-up that this child was put in  can be an absolute minefield for sensitive and vulnerable children and teenagers - or indeed any child or teenager - and there is not nearly enough awareness of the need for children who might be at risk to be closely watched and given empathy and support and guidance.

This is truly such a sad case and it is really just the tip of a giant ice-berg. So very, very sad. But I would be amazed if a closer look at the family dynamic and background would not reveal a host of clues as to what ultimately made this child so unhappy that she took her own life. 

Quite often in these cases it appears to be to do with bullying from other children. But of course bullying can also be from adults and this is likely to be much more insidious and covert.

Well I think you are oversimplifying this and pointing the finger of blame.

I agree the step-father does not appear to be an all round Mr Nice Guy. He is clearly a liar to have a fraud conviction and I agree an animal welfare prosecution is a big red flag.

However that does not prove he was abusing Amber, but is evidence of his conduct and character.

For the sake of argument, let's assume Amber and her mum were being mistreated by the step-father. The next question would be why was the step-father behaving in this manner. I can only speak of the situation that unfolded in my family. My grandfather was a sociopath. In fact my psychologist described him as a "text book sociopath" when I explained how he treated his own children and how he treated me.

My dad was an abuser, but why? Well he inherited the sociopath genes but was also raised in a violent and abusive home. So both nature and nurture were not on his side.

Now let's consider Amber's mum. If stepfather is an abuser, why is she in a relationship with him? He does not sound like a great catch, a convicted criminal who has spent time behind bars. Well it is probably because she is a vulnerable adult. Perhaps she has depression or another mental health problem. Perhaps she was raised abusively and so is unable to spot the "red flags" of abusive behaviour. Medical research has shown that women who get into domestic violence relationships tend to have abusive upbringings and perceive abuse as normal.

Amber would have shared 50% of her genetic make up with mum. Therefore if mum has mental health issues, Amber is at an increased genetic risk. Things like depression do have some genetic component to them. 

Amber could have also had other mental health issues, perhaps a personality disorder or she could have been on the autistic spectrum. As none of us have access to her medical notes we cannot rule out such possibilities.

I have seen what a suicide can do to a family. My uncle's death was far more devastating than my mother's. There is something natural about dying of cancer, but suicide by overdose is not natural and the most tragic end. I witnessed the impact this had on my grandmother and my father (grandfather seemed genuinely not bothered by it). If I was pointing the finger of blame, which I am not, I would say the psychiatric unit was the most liable for letting him out in a suicidal state. He died only days after being released. My grandfather and father did not really help matters and my grandmother struggled due to mental health issues of her own. Having dealt with this over two decades I have now got to the point where I do not blame anyone. It is what it is, a tragic decision that was made by someone who was not in a sound state of mind. 

I know for a fact that even abusers love their children. It is just they do it in a dysfunctional way. I have no doubt Amber's mum will forever be racked with guilt over what has happened. So too will the step-father, unless he is a clinical psychopath, which is a possibility bearing in mind his criminal convictions. 

I just do not feel this is the correct time to be pointing the finger of blame at anyone. We do not have enough information to do this.

The McCanns, however is an entirely different matter and I would not criticise anyone for having a pretty low opinion of them.

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Re: Amber Peat (13) is missing.

Post by joyce1938 on 06.06.15 15:27

Yes I feel we need to use a bit of caution of whom we accuse here. So easy to have got to be cynical over this problem of trying to work out truth of what may have occurred there. Don't let us get to that point ,kids do often take against step parents ,just because ,they don't even know why themselves sometimes. joyce1938

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