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Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by aiyoyo on 30.04.15 14:47

Ladyinred wrote:"The investigation will come to an end sooner or later and Kate and Gerry will use the official Madeleine fund and any awards made to them to continue their own search."

So they know that whenever OG's investigation ends, it won't have found their daughter.

That's just PR shit. CM talking out of his bum to earn his keep.
I don't believe they will spend another penny on the search even post SY.
If the biggest/best police institution in the land cannot find her, what's the chance for their third rate/bogus private eyes ?

The suspension of their private search is proof they know she is dead.  If they believe private eyes can get result (despite Police) why don't they keep the parallel investigation going?

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Two good points for Amaral's appeal

Post by Tony Bennett on 30.04.15 14:49

@Bishop Brennan wrote:
The enormous disconnect between her demeanour in court / the written findings - and the extraordinary cash award is what has shocked everyone on both sides.  Did TPTB sense (as everybody else did) that the trial had slipped away from the McCanns and step in somehow...?  

As [aiyoyo] rightly points out she has had to ignore ALL of the evidence given in court and write a jurisprudence essay on competing rights. She could in fact have written this essay at any point - no need even for a trial and all its delays.  And in fact that very same balance of competing rights was pretty much what the Supreme Court ruled on during the book appeal.  

Up until now, the appeal courts seem to have been immune from external influence, and I can't imagine they will take kindly to their ruling being overturned - the Lisbon judge effectively telling them that they got it wrong...!
Another very curious aspect of the decision appears to have been the complete absence, so far as I could see, of any qualified and independent medical evidence to back up the McCanns' claims of 'irreparable emotional damage, perpetual insomnia, loss of appetite', or whatever other emotional and physical ailments they were claiming.

In a British court, in such a case, expert psychiatric and medical evidence would have been called - and no doubt challenged by the other parties and the judge.

But there was none of it.

Apart, that is, from that Alan Pike bloke, who claimed he was a psychologist and then admitted in court that he wasn't. In fact, he had been an advocate of the McCanns from Day One, flown over one presumes at the expense of Bell Pottinger or the British government (or both), and no way could be classed as 'independent'.

Moreover, there was quite a bit of evidence during the trial process about whether - to the extent that the McCanns actually were emotionally damaged -

     


whether this alleged damage was caused more by the loss of their beloved first-born daughter or by Amaral's book, or 'work' as Clarence Mitchell once contemptuously called it.

There was nothing about that in the final verdict either AFAIK.

Yet the judge awarded every penny (sorry, every cent) they claimed for their emotional damage.

Two very good points for whichever lawyer appeals this to the Appeal Court, I would have thought!

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by sallypelt on 30.04.15 14:52

@Tony Bennett wrote:
@Bishop Brennan wrote:
The enormous disconnect between her demeanour in court / the written findings - and the extraordinary cash award is what has shocked everyone on both sides.  Did TPTB sense (as everybody else did) that the trial had slipped away from the McCanns and step in somehow...?  

As [aiyoyo] rightly points out she has had to ignore ALL of the evidence given in court and write a jurisprudence essay on competing rights. She could in fact have written this essay at any point - no need even for a trial and all its delays.  And in fact that very same balance of competing rights was pretty much what the Supreme Court ruled on during the book appeal.  

Up until now, the appeal courts seem to have been immune from external influence, and I can't imagine they will take kindly to their ruling being overturned - the Lisbon judge effectively telling them that they got it wrong...!
Another very curious aspect of the decision appears to have been the complete absence, so far as I could see, of any qualified and independent medical evidence to back up the McCanns' claims of 'irreparable emotional damage, perpetual insomnia, loss of appetite', or whatever other emotional and physical ailments they were claiming.

In a British court, in such a case, expert psychiatric and medical evidence would have been called - and no doubt challenged by the other parties and the judge.

But there was none of it.

Apart, that is, from that Alan Pike bloke, who claimed he was a psychologist and then admitted in court that he wasn't. In fact, he had been an advocate of the McCanns from Day One, flown over one presumes at the expense of Bell Pottinger or the British government (or both), and no way could be classed as 'independent'.

Moreover, there was quite a bit of evidence during the trial process about whether - to the extent that the McCanns actually were emotionally damaged -

     


whether this alleged damage was caused more by the loss of their beloved first-born daughter or by Amaral's book, or 'work' as Clarence Mitchell once contemptuously called it.

There was nothing about that in the final verdict either AFAIK.

Yet the judge awarded every penny (sorry, every cent) they claimed for their emotional damage.

Two very good points for whichever lawyer appeals this to the Appeal Court, I would have thought!

What a nice little earner for the lawyers, judges etc in this sorry saga. The longer this goes on, the fatter their bank accounts become.

I am in the wrong business.

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by jimuck on 30.04.15 15:00

@BlueBag wrote:
@endgame wrote:What I find most bizarre about the judgement, and I hope that this provides some basis for appeal, is that the judge found almost all of the McCanns' allegations not proven and only one partially proven - yet awarded them individually almost all of what they had claimed for the whole set of alleged list of damages. It would be reasonable to expect that if £250K was the required sum for the total individual claim, then if the claim were only partially accepted, there would be a commensurate reduction in the amount awarded. To say in effect that "I only accept that you have proved one tenth of your case but I'll award you nine tenths of what you have claimed" defies any kind of rationale.
Unless the judge was inviting an appeal.

The McCanns should tread very carefully, Mr Amaral is dragging them down a path here which they may never recover from. Clever man that Mr Amaral.

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by jeanmonroe on 30.04.15 15:06

"BREAKING" news!

Leicestershire Police to be 'investigated' about their erm 'role' in the Janner 'case'!

On Sky News, shortly!

Can't wait for the day Leicestershire Police, possibly, to be 'investigated' about their erm 'role' in the Madeleine McCann 'case'

or

OG + (BHH)

or

CPS.

or

DC and TM
-------------------------------------------------------------------
"We prefer not to discuss this with Detective Superintendent Stuart Prior of Leicestershire Police, we have the impression that he is only here to accompany the McCanns' interrogations and to prevent their detention. His concern on that subject is obvious."

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by Guest on 30.04.15 15:15

[quote="Richard IV"][quote="Portia"]Have I missed something?

Has anyone seen the full version yet?

Where could I find it?

Thanks in advance![/quote]

Doug D started posting a translation of the whole thing here

http://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t11227-google-translation-of-the-judgement-part-1

or here if you can read Portuguese

 [url=http://www.eliphashardi.eu/][size=15]http://www.eliphashardi.eu/[/size][/url][/quote]


friends

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by PeterMac on 30.04.15 15:38

@Tony Bennett wrote:Yet the judge awarded every penny (sorry, every cent) they claimed for their emotional damage.
And then took it all back again by awarding 58.7% of the costs AGAINST them.

And a further 50% from the other case to be paid by both parent and by the TWINS, whom they had joined in the action, one supposes to try to gain the sympathy vote.
As it is they seem to have burdened the twins with a financial liability.

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by jeanmonroe on 30.04.15 15:43

@PeterMac wrote:
@Tony Bennett wrote:Yet the judge awarded every penny (sorry, every cent) they claimed for their emotional damage.
And then took it all back again by awarding 58.7% of the costs AGAINST them.

And a further 50% from the other case to be paid by both parent and by the TWINS, whom they had joined in the action, one supposes to try to gain the sympathy vote.
As it is they seem to have burdened the twins with a financial liability.

I'm still not getting 'it' PeterMac.

"And a further 50% from the other case"

What 'other' case?

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Heads nor tails

Post by Guest on 30.04.15 15:55

Frankly, it's some sort of chinese to me.

Who must pay euro 250.000 to mr & mrs?

dr A or all four defendants together?

AFAIK dr A made around euro 370.000 from the booksale: it appears Judge M&C took that away from him plus some. 

Very strangely argued  decision

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by Joss on 30.04.15 16:48

This is good news, raised over $2k in one day already for GA's defense fund
http://www.gofundme.com/Legal-DefencePJGA

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by aiyoyo on 30.04.15 16:49

@Bishop Brennan wrote:
It may in fact be the ONLY way to award a win and 500k to the McCanns DESPITE the complete lack of credible evidence.  

Not as simple as that I should think.  
Look at it this way - for argument sake, even if say evidence supports an award, why the unprecedented size of award (nearly 4 times the historic records iirc)?
Why the need to write a jurisprudence essay on competing rights just to justify breaking the record?

Personally, I think her jurisprudence essay has got to do with her putting one over the higher level Courts. It's the only possible way she can rule in Mcs favour ie by over riding the higher courts using this method.  As you rightly noticed, the verdict is an enormous disconnect between her demeanor in court, and also the size of award does not reconcile with proportion of her established proven and unproven facts.

In fact, I'd go so far as to say the deliberate unprecedented hugh award size shows malice towards Amaral, which in turn reveals a hidden biased I should think.

There must be a compelling (and probably not so innocent) reason for her to write a last minute essay on jurisprudence on competing rights, when that was never raised or hinted as a possible issue for deliberation point. Otherwise you'd think this angle would have been covered by lawyers.

Appeal court deliberates on lawyers submitted documentations with no court session involved if I am not wrong, so the process is completely different from a trial court.  

 The enormous disconnect between her demeanour in court / the written findings - and the extraordinary cash award is what has shocked everyone on both sides.  Did TPTB sense (as everybody else did) that the trial had slipped away from the McCanns and step in somehow...?  

The disconnect hints at a darker force influence, either that, or a biased.

As you rightly point out she has had to ignore ALL of the evidence given in court and write a jurisprudence essay on competing rights. She could in fact have written this essay at any point - no need even for a trial and all its delays.  And in fact that very same balance of competing rights was pretty much what the Supreme Court ruled on during the book appeal.  Except that this judge has now come to a different conclusion...      

Would be interesting to know what had precipitated the delays, and if that had any influence on her deliberation method?

Up until now, the appeal courts seem to have been immune from external influence, and I can't imagine they will take kindly to their ruling being overturned - the Lisbon judge effectively telling them that they got it wrong...!

Quite.  Effectively !  
One Lisbon Judge against at least 4 (3 judges of 2nd Instance Court and presuming one more (if not more) at the Highest Appeal Court).  That's quite a take on !

Be interesting to watch what pans out after this..... if this Lisbon Judge is going to be admonished like the "wet behind the ears" judge in the first instance court?


After what looked like a knock-out blow yesterday, perhaps there is still a round or two left in this fight...    pray2

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by Joss on 30.04.15 17:03

30 Apr 2015


A Message From Gonçalo Amaral




I find that the court's decision is unfair and questions my right and every Portuguese citizen's right to freedom of expression and of opinion.

For that reason, I do not resign myself to the decision and I will appeal it until the very last judicial instance. 

If I am able to continue counting on your support, I will continue to fight within the judicial system for the Truth and the achievement of Justice.

Thank you. 




We would like to add a few words of our own. 

This week's verdict is the result of a long, drawn-out trial. It is far from over, as we now enter the appeals phase. 


Your ongoing support - both moral and financial - has been key to Gonçalo Amaral's ability to defend himself. 


There are no words that can adequately express our gratitude, as we have witnessed so many acts of solidarity over the last five years. It has been a humbling journey; a journey of learning and of sharing.


Now we need to reach the end of it.


Thank you.

Posted by astro at Thursday, April 30, 2015

Labels: Amaral, [url=http://pjga.blogspot.pt/search/label/Freedom of Expression]Freedom of Expression[/url], [url=http://pjga.blogspot.pt/search/label/Gon%C3%A7alo Amaral]Gonçalo Amaral[/url], Justice, [url=http://pjga.blogspot.pt/search/label/Libel Trial]Libel Trial[/url]

http://pjga.blogspot.pt/2015/04/a-message-from-goncalo-amaral_12.html

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by HelenMeg on 30.04.15 17:05

@Joss wrote:This is good news, raised over $2k in one day already for GA's defense fund
http://www.gofundme.com/Legal-DefencePJGA
Fantastic - lets put our money where are mouths are -
thumbup

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by worriedmum on 30.04.15 17:07

I'm just snipping the following (lengthy) section from Blacksmith's latest offering, reproducing the reasons for the judgement against Snr Amaral


''In the case-law of the European Court of Human Rights the principle of presumption of innocence imposes a standard of conduct for all agents, employees and magistrates involved in the administration of criminal justice.
According to the ECHR the presumption of innocence prohibits the premature expression of opinions or belief in guilt  by the courts and in addition bans the claims of any public servants  involved in procedures which might lead the public to believe in the culpability of  suspects under investigation. In the  Karaman process deriving from the German courts it has been held in this context that Article 6 § 2 aims at preventing the undermining of a fair  trial by damaging statements made in close connection with proceedings. It not only prohibits the premature expression by the court itself of the opinion that a suspect is guilty but also covers statements made by other public officials about pending criminal investigations which encourage the public to believe the suspect guilty and prejudge an assessment of the facts by the competent judicial authority.
The Allen process deriving from the UK emphasizes the importance of the presumption after the acquittal or dismissal of the criminal investigation, explaining that this principle prevents suspects or defendants in such cases being treated as if they were in fact responsible for the criminal offences of which they were accused and stressing that without this second level of protection -the level of full respect for acquittal or archiving- the presumption of innocence is illusory or merely ideal.”


Does this mean that the judge wishes to avoid pre-judgement and wishes to uphold the right to be deemed innocent until proven guilty?

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by lj on 30.04.15 17:15

@jimuck wrote:
@Bishop Brennan wrote:
@Silverspeed wrote:An appalling headline to this article although hardly surprising.

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/439410/Madeleine-McCann-Kate-Gerry-357k-libel-cash

That article is interesting not for its headline but because it contains the first indications of the imminent wind-down of Operation Grange.

McCanns’ spokesman Clarence Mitchell said: “The investigation will come to an end sooner or later and Kate and Gerry will use the official Madeleine fund and any awards made to them to continue their own search.’’

A statement that implies to me that OG will be winding down shortly and that it will wind down without a result.
One thing I thought most had learned from 8 years of Clarence Mitchell, was not to believe a single letter that comes out of this persons mouth.

Operation Grange and previous investigations have IMO done their job.


Yes, the description "he lies with all the teeth he has" is awfully accurate.

____________________
"And if Madeleine had hurt herself inside the apartment, why would that be our fault?"  Gerry

http://pjga.blogspot.co.uk/?m=0

http://whatreallyhappenedtomadeleinemccann.blogspot.co.uk/

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by Joss on 30.04.15 17:23

@worriedmum wrote:I'm just snipping the following (lengthy) section from Blacksmith's latest offering, reproducing the reasons for the judgement against Snr Amaral


''In the case-law of the European Court of Human Rights the principle of presumption of innocence imposes a standard of conduct for all agents, employees and magistrates involved in the administration of criminal justice.
According to the ECHR the presumption of innocence prohibits the premature expression of opinions or belief in guilt  by the courts and in addition bans the claims of any public servants  involved in procedures which might lead the public to believe in the culpability of  suspects under investigation. In the  Karaman process deriving from the German courts it has been held in this context that Article 6 § 2 aims at preventing the undermining of a fair  trial by damaging statements made in close connection with proceedings. It not only prohibits the premature expression by the court itself of the opinion that a suspect is guilty but also covers statements made by other public officials about pending criminal investigations which encourage the public to believe the suspect guilty and prejudge an assessment of the facts by the competent judicial authority.
The Allen process deriving from the UK emphasizes the importance of the presumption after the acquittal or dismissal of the criminal investigation, explaining that this principle prevents suspects or defendants in such cases being treated as if they were in fact responsible for the criminal offences of which they were accused and stressing that without this second level of protection -the level of full respect for acquittal or archiving- the presumption of innocence is illusory or merely ideal.”


Does this mean that the judge wishes to avoid pre-judgement and wishes to uphold the right to be deemed innocent until proven guilty?
No idea if that is applicable in this case, because if it were the PJ files would be brought into question too wouldn't they? This has been no straightforward case as compared to other missing child cases, with all the political interference of which the reasons for it remains a mystery to the public in general, which to my knowledge there was never an explanation as to why that happened.
I think we would need someone well versed in legalese to answer these questions for us. But if GA's lawyer thinks there is a case for appeal then that's good enough for me.

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by lj on 30.04.15 18:39

@Joss wrote:This is good news, raised over $2k in one day already for GA's defense fund
http://www.gofundme.com/Legal-DefencePJGA


I made my donation to the other site:

http://pjga.blogspot.co.uk/?m=0

before I knew there was a gofundme thing. It's all the same I assume.

On that site a message from Dr. Amaral and Astro:


I find that the court's decision is unfair and questions my right and every Portuguese citizen's right to freedom of expression and of opinion. 

For that reason, I do not resign myself to the decision and I will appeal it until the very last judicial instance. 

If I am able to continue counting on your support, I will continue to fight within the judicial system for the Truth and the achievement of Justice.

Thank you. 




We would like to add a few words of our own. 

This week's verdict is the result of a long, drawn-out trial. It is far from over, as we now enter the appeals phase. 


Your ongoing support - both moral and financial - has been key to Gonçalo Amaral's ability to defend himself. 


There are no words that can adequately express our gratitude, as we have witnessed so many acts of solidarity over the last five years. It has been a humbling journey; a journey of learning and of sharing.


Now we need to reach the end of it.


Thank you.


Posted by astro at Thursday, April 30, 2015 14 comments: 

____________________
"And if Madeleine had hurt herself inside the apartment, why would that be our fault?"  Gerry

http://pjga.blogspot.co.uk/?m=0

http://whatreallyhappenedtomadeleinemccann.blogspot.co.uk/

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by Wahrheit on 30.04.15 18:45

I haven't read everything (forgive me) but from the sound of it the Judge has decide that the "right to a good name" trumps the right to freedom of expression. I find this interesting as "the authors'" name has been tarnished by their own, admitted serious neglect which was the proximate cause of the tragedy, they claim. Nonetheless, she assessed the quantum at the claimed amount. Certainly, if one is accused without proof of a terrible crime but one has admitted gross negligence, and been fortunate to escape criminal consequences for it, then there is some theoretical "damage" but one would have thought that there would have been more of a symbolic award to reflect the facts and their "standing" in terms of reputation.

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by Joss on 30.04.15 19:14

@Wahrheit wrote:I haven't read everything (forgive me) but from the sound of it the Judge has decide that the "right to a good name" trumps the right to freedom of expression. I find this interesting as "the authors'" name has been tarnished by their own, admitted serious neglect which was the proximate cause of the tragedy, they claim. Nonetheless, she assessed the quantum at the claimed amount. Certainly, if one is accused without proof of a terrible crime but one has admitted gross negligence, and been fortunate to escape criminal consequences for it, then there is some theoretical "damage" but one would have thought that there would have been more of a symbolic award to reflect the facts and their "standing" in terms of reputation.
Good points. This judgement seems very unfair on Mr. Amaral.

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by Joss on 30.04.15 19:20

I think if anyone has a good case to bring before the ECHR it would be Goncalo Amaral.


What rights do most cases
concern?
In about one half of the judgments finding a
violation since its establishment, the Court
has found a violation of Article 6 of the
Convention, concerning both the fairness
and the length of proceedings. In fact, 55% of
the violations found by the Court concern
either Article 6 (right to a fair hearing) or
Article 1 of Protocol No. 1 (protection of
property). Then in about 13% of cases, the
Court has found a serious violation of the
Convention under Articles 2 and 3 of the
Convention (right to life and prohibition
of torture and inhuman or degrading
treatment
http://www.echr.coe.int/Documents/50Questions_ENG.pdf

Just how fair has it been to GA to drag this case on for so long, and do we actually know if the freezing of his assets indefinitely is even legal? The protection of property is interesting, wonder what that entails exactly?

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by Nina on 30.04.15 19:39

For any members who wish to contribute,this is the thread we have on Hideho's Facebook group.


http://www.gofundme.com/Legal-DefencePJGA

____________________
Not one more cent from me.

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by worriedmum on 30.04.15 21:12

just seen this -

''

£5
Isabel Duarte
5 hours ago
Thank you, Dr Amaral.''

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by sammyc on 30.04.15 21:20

After this appalling decision by the Judge I immediately donated 15 euros which worked out at just over £11.00 which is what I spend having a few drinks most days after work.  For Dr Amaral to sacrifice his family, career and reputation for justice for Madeleine I am sure I can sacrifice at least one day each week off the drink to make further donations.

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by HelenMeg on 30.04.15 21:39

@Nina wrote:For any members who wish to contribute,this is the thread we have on Hideho's Facebook group.


http://www.gofundme.com/Legal-DefencePJGA
At £2892 - this is great. At least we are now making a difference to him..

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Re: Goncalo Has Lost the Libel trial

Post by sallypelt on 30.04.15 22:34

Fund has now reached £3,007

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