The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann™
Hi,

A very warm welcome to The Complete Mystery of Madeleine McCann™ forum.

Please log in, or register to view all the forums, then settle in and start chatting with us!

Enjoy your day,

Jill Havern
Forum owner

"The Madeleine McCann Case and Occam's Razor"

Page 4 of 4 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Re: "The Madeleine McCann Case and Occam's Razor"

Post by Verdi on 25.04.15 12:40

@plebgate wrote:Snipped from Verdi's post:


"It used to be Bill and Ben but now it Britney and Beiber, I know which I prefer and it's not the latter.  This brings me to encouraging children to be sex objects, even if only by dressing them in mini versions of the young trollops that dominate the media.  If parents didn't succumb to the temptation of sexualising their kids, the market would dry up very rapidly and kids might actually revert to being kids who, in addition to all my other moans, should be allowed to develop at their own pace, after all you wouldn't force feed your child if it wasn't hungry would you?  Why encourage kids to be teenagers before their time or teenagers to be adults?"

I would add to that - it used to be Nursery Rhymes now it seems some think it acceptable to sing along to Pussy Cat Doll songs such as Don't Cha.

Never heard the likes.


Don't cha wish your girlfriend was hot like me.     I certainly do not think it is an appropriate song for such young children to be listening to.
Precisely!

What about that dreadful creature that's always got it's tongue hanging out?  I once read complaints made by parents (mostly mothers) about her disgusting performance at a live concert, that's after they had paid to go see the thing!  I mean, come on!  Her half naked body is frequently featured in the tabloids so what the hell did they expect, Mary Poppins?

Flicking through any brain dead magazine these days is like looking at a mail order catalogue for Victorian porcelain dolls.  They all look the same, no individuality.  False hair false body bits false nails false warpaint false teeth - and that's only the guys!

I'm sure there a thousand more examples waiting to be on the list but I'll get a flea in my ear for derailing the thread smilie .

Verdi

Posts : 3560
Reputation : 2070
Join date : 2015-02-02

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: "The Madeleine McCann Case and Occam's Razor"

Post by XTC on 25.04.15 23:35

@Verdi wrote:Portia today @ 11:37 pm

Very interesting, thanks for posting the link,  perfect illustration of the mass cover-up that's going on and rocking the very foundations of un-Great Britain, such magnitude the McCanns are swallowed up into oblivion as mere small fry, if it's possible to turn a blind eye to key players in the running of our lives, the McCanns are an insipid garnish, a poor mans tartar source. 

Still, you know what they say about sprats being bait for bit brother, the mackeral.
Fair points one and all.

There are cover ups and ' Establishment ' cover ups.

Lord Janner it appears was capable of signing for his House of Lords appearance payments but he is allegedly in
no position to answer questions to the police about the allegations the police wish to question him about.

Doanald Rumsfeld was asked by a Senate Committee as to whatt happened to roughly 2 trillion ( yes trillion ) Dollars of American peoples money and he replied that he didn't know.

He ( like Mr Janner ) was quizzed no further.

The media quizzed no further and that was that and this is this.

So, in my opinion it is the same case with the missingness of Madeleine.

Mr Amaral and his team queried it and since then it has not been queried.

There's a search alright but not the one we think it should be.

For myself it is reasonably simple:

The Public ( not media driven - nor Mitchell driven  ) statement from Scotland Yard is to treat the " abduction " as if it happened in the UK.

Unless the parents of missing Madeleine were at odds over her ownership then this means that someone else abducted her.

This is how simple the investigation is to me.

Unless Operation Grange have a remit we don't know about - say: this is what we are saying officially for media and public consumption but really we are closing the net on the real perpetrators then that is all there is.

The truth is in my opinion is that you don't need a whitewash - you need time and fading memories.

From the person who was in charge of Public Safety at Hillsborough to Mr Janner et al that's all you need until you are dead.

Then they can convict all they like in the media whether the story is true or not.

The problem in this particular case is that this is going to take a long time to emerge.

p.s. As was the case with the Leicester Police initially and currently as far as I know, the Official Secrets Act is signed when you sign to be a copper.

Does it really need restating and signing?

If so- what for?

XTC

Posts : 210
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2014-03-23

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: "The Madeleine McCann Case and Occam's Razor"

Post by joyce1938 on 26.04.15 10:17

The thing I find most amazing is this ..      The leicister police group who worked alongside PJ in fact totally agreed with them ,how is that not talked about today . Does it mean that out of the blue leic. policwe called back here and then no more is said about them being part of the helping pj to start with and agreeing in all matters I think .?   joyce1938

joyce1938

Posts : 805
Reputation : 86
Join date : 2010-04-20
Age : 77
Location : england

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: "The Madeleine McCann Case and Occam's Razor"

Post by Angelique on 26.04.15 10:58

XTC

You wrote:

"The truth is in my opinion is that you don't need a whitewash - you need time and fading memories."


Totally agree. 


I have thought this for some time.


I think the bashing of doubters etc., the BL tragedy, the SP and now the JK are all about this. 


We are still here, on Facebook, Twitter across the pond etc. 


The way to deal with something that wont go away until all are long gone (dead) is to keep threatening them and make critical docu's about "us". They also get a slice of the ummm, takings.

____________________
Things aren't always what they seem

Angelique

Posts : 1396
Reputation : 35
Join date : 2010-10-19

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: "The Madeleine McCann Case and Occam's Razor"

Post by Hobs on 26.04.15 14:56

it’s not us that’s committed this crime

This is close, that is distancing

____________________
The little unremembered acts of kindness and love are the best parts of a person's life.

Hobs

Posts : 715
Reputation : 288
Join date : 2012-10-20
Age : 52
Location : uk

View user profile http://tania-cadogan.blogspot.co.uk/

Back to top Go down

Re: "The Madeleine McCann Case and Occam's Razor"

Post by j.rob on 26.04.15 16:08

@HelenMeg wrote:
@Mark Willis wrote:
@HelenMeg wrote:"As a theory it works when you consider the Gaspars, the bathing, Payne's "Pact" his call to that child line body, the adult-applied make up to Maddie. A horrid thought but then the truth can hurt.

All that and the notorious page 129 of Kate's bewk.

I feel ill as I type this but if this is what it is all about then let's say I wouldn't be exactly surprised." snipped from above post by MarkWillis

But also please consider that this is perhaps what they, Team Mc Cann, would like you to think.
There are people who want the truth to be hidden at all costs. They will certainly be aiming that we are discussing plenty of red herrings. They will be feeding us lots of red herrings so that we spend time discussing them and being distracted by them.. How do we tell what is a red herring and what isnt ?

So if this really was about M being abused at the age of three whilst on holiday and dying from it - do you realy think all these people would have hidden it and made sure it remained hidden?  I dont - not for one minute.   all imo  
Yes, I do believe they would hide it, it's not something you'd want anyone to know is it?
Look at the Westminster Inquiry. May made certain she delayed; 1st by appointing a blatantly unsuitable person: 2nd she did the same again; Thirdly delayed by the forthcoming election.
Why did Blair slap a D-notice on Op Ore? That was a rhetorical question btw.
It is an entirely plausible theory although I grant you, the Mcs et al are masters of deflection, like the neglect-and-check nonsense we all swallowed for way too long.
But do you think Rachel, Fiona, Jane Kate and anyone else in the know amongst the 60 guests would club together and hide the fact that a 3 year old  had been sexually abused...by one of them? Obviously if Madeleine had been sexually abused and died, the perpetrators would have needed it to be covered up but what I am saying is, do you really think that all of the guests/ friends / parents would cover it up?

If so, that implies that it was done with their permission..is that what you're thinking?

I suspect that there was abuse and then medical neglect. It's that bad, imo.

I think she was drugged and sexually abused. The hugely dodgy 'Lolita' style pictures released later also lead me to suspect that there was or had been some filming of child porn. Kate herself refers often to this very subject in her book.

I fear that Madeleine was sedated but woke up during an incident (regrettably an incident relating to the above). She became hysterical and inconsolable. Perhaps, imo, Kate or someone (Gerry?) 'clobbered' her (one of the male tapasniks actually used this word in one of the rogatories). I think both Kate and Gerry have issues with anger management and this I suspect was compounded by heavy alcohol use that week. 

If the report that appeared in the Portuguese press that Madeleine is not Gerry's biological father is true, then that might explain why Madeleine was treated differently to the twins. Although I have to say that Gerry's interactions with Amelie that I have seen in the Madeleine was Here series suggest to me that he treats her very differently to Sean.

But back to the crying incident. Kate in an early media interview becomes visibly agitated when discussing the incident in which Madeleine work up one night. Kate even mimes vigorously shaking Madeleine's shoulders as she says she should have found out what woke Madeleine up. Kate repeats: "What do you mean you woke up?" in a distressed fashion. This is clearly a very sensitive subject. And I suspect Kate chose not to find out what had distressed Madeleine so deeply.

In the media interview, Gerry looks on with an expression that is not unlike that of a naughty schoolboy shrugging his shoulders as if to say: "what can you do?" and then says something like: "She just dropped it," which is supposed to convey that Madeleine just dropped the subject the next morning. It actually sounds as though he says: "She just dropped dead," which I would imagine is what he wanted to convey to those of the group who knew something terrible had happened, but did not know quite what, perhaps. (Female tapas perhaps?) Gerry and David Payne (and the other male tapas, perhaps?) could have pretended there had been an accident or an overdose - certainly to the wider family members, imo. 

I suspect that by the next morning after the crying incident Madeleine was in no fit state. Hence the Mcs are so keen to make it appear that everything was fine the next morning and indeed in subsequent days right up until Thursday evening. I suspect she was very far from fine and this group of despicable doctors not only did not try to save her, but one or several of them deliberately silenced her.

The Mcs keenness to minimize the crying incident  suggests to me it was pivotal to what happened that week.

It is horrible to contemplate this but this must be a scenario that is not that unusual in child abuse cases. An abused child is deliberately silenced so as not to attract attention to the perpetrator/s of the crime. Gerry strikes me as cold, manipulative - a psychopath, imo. 

I theorize that  Kate, at least, suspects Gerry (and David Payne, maybe even other male tapas?) are paedos but psychologically she cannot/could not admit this to herself. For all sorts of reasons not the least of which is that the father of her three (now two) children could be put behind bars. And having to confront the reality, imo, that one of her children would still be alive today if she had made a better choice of partner.

A theory, as always. And I would like to be wrong because it is horrible to contemplate such things. But every single utterance from either Kate or Gerry leads me to believe that they are BOTH complicit in what happened but just in slightly different ways.

And if my theory that Kate has adopted the ostrich approach with regard to her suspicions is correct, then that would tie in with the theory that it might have been Kate who lashed out at Madeleine in anger. Silencing the messenger. Again, I would imagine that this is not that unusual in child abuse cases where the father is very domineering and the mother of the children is in denial and/or weak/narcissistic (with regard to the latter both the Mcs are, imo).

j.rob

Posts : 2243
Reputation : 225
Join date : 2014-02-02

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: "The Madeleine McCann Case and Occam's Razor"

Post by j.rob on 26.04.15 16:14

@roy rovers wrote:
@Tony Bennett wrote:
@roy rovers wrote:The problem with conspiracy theories is the impossibility and logistics of keeping all the actors silent after the event. Take the theory that the Apollo moon landings were faked...It would have directly involved thousands and even more thousands of others would be 'in the know'.
Point taken and agreed re the Apollo moon landings.

But, how many were involved or were 'in the know' about (Sir) Jimmy Savile?

How many were involved or were 'in the know' about (Sir) Cyril Smith?

How many were involved or were 'in the know' about, say, Lord Brittan?

And what is the common denominator in all the above?

The rape and abuse of young children.

Some of the top people who do this are devious, manipulative, and powerful - and they 'control what comes out in the media'.

Yes but these were conspiracies of silence not active conspiracies to pervert the course of justice.
I think the T9 are involved in a conspiracy to conceal the truth about what happened to MM but how wide does the conspiracy stretch? I doubt Rupert Murdoch is in on it. IMO he just wants to sell newspapers - firstly with the abduction story and no doubt later with another story that he is sitting on waiting for the public mood to change so that he can profit from that too.

I think there was a pre-arranged plan for a media abduction hoax designed to sell papers and usher in more state control. Plus induce paranoia. This got messed up, imo. Or was deliberately sabotaged. Maybe a bit of both. It got messed up by the Mcs and then someone sabotaged the hoax, realizing it was far darker than it seemed.

j.rob

Posts : 2243
Reputation : 225
Join date : 2014-02-02

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: "The Madeleine McCann Case and Occam's Razor"

Post by j.rob on 26.04.15 16:25

@Hobs wrote:it’s not us that’s committed this crime

This is close, that is distancing

I think that quite often with TM that if you remove the negative or turn the positive into negative, you get the truth. It's that simple. TM are really very unsubtle.


j.rob

Posts : 2243
Reputation : 225
Join date : 2014-02-02

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: "The Madeleine McCann Case and Occam's Razor"

Post by Verdi on 26.04.15 22:20

j.rob today @ 5:08 pm

Excellent stuff, I can only find fault with one aspect - Kate Mccann.  I know it's not unusual for a spouse or other close relative to go into denial where abuse is going on the the family home but I can't be convinced that Kate is one.  Her Oscar winning performances are not true to life, I feel theatrical comedy/tragedy masks would be more appropriate to her public persona.

Her words and behaviour have shown her to be a cold and calculating, vindictive, a narcissistic all round thoroughly evil woman.  Don't forget, she knows what happened because she was there!  There was a pact.

Verdi

Posts : 3560
Reputation : 2070
Join date : 2015-02-02

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: "The Madeleine McCann Case and Occam's Razor"

Post by Verdi on 26.04.15 22:27

Graham Ovenden, convicted con-artiste



Gerry and Kate McCann, unconvicted con-artists


Verdi

Posts : 3560
Reputation : 2070
Join date : 2015-02-02

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: "The Madeleine McCann Case and Occam's Razor"

Post by lj on 27.04.15 2:58

@Verdi wrote:j.rob today @ 5:08 pm

Excellent stuff, I can only find fault with one aspect - Kate Mccann.  I know it's not unusual for a spouse or other close relative to go into denial where abuse is going on the the family home but I can't be convinced that Kate is one.  Her Oscar winning performances are not true to life, I feel theatrical comedy/tragedy masks would be more appropriate to her public persona.

Her words and behaviour have shown her to be a cold and calculating, vindictive, a narcissistic all round thoroughly evil woman.  Don't forget, she knows what happened because she was there!  There was a pact.


Absolutely agree.

____________________
"And if Madeleine had hurt herself inside the apartment, why would that be our fault?"  Gerry

http://pjga.blogspot.co.uk/?m=0

http://whatreallyhappenedtomadeleinemccann.blogspot.co.uk/

lj

Posts : 3276
Reputation : 148
Join date : 2009-12-01

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: "The Madeleine McCann Case and Occam's Razor"

Post by Verdi on 27.04.15 12:15

XTC yesterday @ 12:35 am

"Lord Janner it appears was capable of signing for his House of Lords appearance payments but he is allegedly in no position to answer questions to the police about the allegations the police wish to question him about."

Yes, a sudden bout of dementia - how convenient.  I've often wondered, if ever push comes to shove, a plea of insanity will be made in Kate McCann's defense.  If you reflect on her many media performances and her book, the signs are there and her hubby has never done or said anything to protect her image, he appears to encourage people to think she is off her trolley.  Add to that all the emphasis made over the years about her state of mind - particularly when trying to screw Amaral for all his worth.

____________________
The secret of life is honesty and fair dealing. If you can fake that, you've got it made" - Groucho Marx

Verdi

Posts : 3560
Reputation : 2070
Join date : 2015-02-02

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: "The Madeleine McCann Case and Occam's Razor"

Post by Verdi on 27.04.15 12:17

@joyce1938 wrote:The thing I find most amazing is this ..      The leicister police group who worked alongside PJ in fact totally agreed with them ,how is that not talked about today . Does it mean that out of the blue leic. policwe called back here and then no more is said about them being part of the helping pj to start with and agreeing in all matters I think .?   joyce1938
It rather looks like that doesn't it, aided and abetted by Stuart 'call me Stu' Prior.

____________________
The secret of life is honesty and fair dealing. If you can fake that, you've got it made" - Groucho Marx

Verdi

Posts : 3560
Reputation : 2070
Join date : 2015-02-02

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: "The Madeleine McCann Case and Occam's Razor"

Post by j.rob on 28.04.15 22:03

@Verdi wrote:j.rob today @ 5:08 pm

Excellent stuff, I can only find fault with one aspect - Kate Mccann.  I know it's not unusual for a spouse or other close relative to go into denial where abuse is going on the the family home but I can't be convinced that Kate is one.  Her Oscar winning performances are not true to life, I feel theatrical comedy/tragedy masks would be more appropriate to her public persona.

Her words and behaviour have shown her to be a cold and calculating, vindictive, a narcissistic all round thoroughly evil woman.  Don't forget, she knows what happened because she was there!  There was a pact.

Oh I agree that Kate is calculating, vindictive and narcissistic. Not to mention breathtakingly duplicitous. But I am just not sure if she is on quite the same page as Gerry with regards to what was going on. 

For one thing, those massive bruises of her hands and wrists when Kate and Gerry first appeared in the media after Madeleine's alleged 'abduction' are suggestive of her being heavily physically restrained during that fateful week. By Gerry, I presume, although not of course impossible that it was someone else. But why?

j.rob

Posts : 2243
Reputation : 225
Join date : 2014-02-02

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: "The Madeleine McCann Case and Occam's Razor"

Post by j.rob on 29.04.15 15:50

Some interesting posts on here and comparisons between the 'Lolita' photos of Madeleine and 'art' produced by paedophile artist Graham Ovenden.

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=258687&page=23

Have a look at post 469. There is an excerpt from an interview with Detective Amaral. He is asked if he thinks the McCann children were sedated. Amaral replies: "There is no doubt."

After that, this is written:

(Here he told an anecdote: that Kate called a colleague of Gonçalo Amaral's in the PJ, in August, to ask them to check the twins for traces of sedation. Apparently Kate was alone when she called, and a bit upset. That same afternoon, Gerry called and cancelled the request.)


Wow! I hadn't heard that before! That again would support my theory that Kate and Gerry are not entirely on the same page with regard to what happened to Madeleine. Why would Gerry cancel Kate's request to check the twins for sedation? Hmmmm....... 


(Adults who sexually abuse children often use drugs and/or alcohol to make the children 'out of it' or compliant.)



A bit like when Kate phoned the PJ in distress saying she had had a dream about Madeleine being buried somewhere, I do believe? Then later Gerry angrily denied this. 


I remain pretty much convinced that Kate and Gerry are not singing from exactly the same hymn-sheet. As I wrote up-thread I think Madeleine awoke one night in great distress. Kate lost her tempter and hit her, imo. One can only sadly speculate what may have woken up Madeleine and distressed her so much. 


Kate chose to turn a blind eye to what the Gaspers had observed about David Payne and Gerry McCann's interest in young girls.  



http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=258687&page=24

j.rob

Posts : 2243
Reputation : 225
Join date : 2014-02-02

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: "The Madeleine McCann Case and Occam's Razor"

Post by suzysu on 08.05.15 0:24



Gerry and Kate McCann, unconvicted con-artists



I've realised why I'm particularly uncomfortable with the above photo. I recall Kate saying that Madeleine had 'got into' (I forget the exact phrase or the reference) her (Kate's) makeup bag and played around as children do (I'm paraphrasing here), smearing makeup on herself. The implication is that Madeleine had applied the makeup herself. I don't know any adult women who keep a blue eyeshadow such as was available in the Miner's range in the 1970s. I also I think this topic has been done before question whether or not a three-year-old has sufficient skills (let alone the ability) to apply eye shadow as shown in the photo. A thoroughly distasteful image, imo.

Hang your heads in shame, TM.





suzysu

Posts : 43
Reputation : 22
Join date : 2014-10-06

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Page 4 of 4 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4

View previous topic View next topic Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum