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Follow the money trail.

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by Khaleesi on 21.12.14 21:00

@ScarletLaw wrote:The item for scent the McCanns tried to give the police first, the police immediately realised had smaller hairs and belonged to the twins. So they had to get something that was Madeleine's?

Smaller hairs? Please. Hair transfer very easily so there would be nothing suspicious in twins hair on Maddie's blanket or clothing. Another thing is that Amelie in 2007 had quite long hair and it would be hard to tell if the single hair on a blanket/towel/whatever belongs to her or to Madeleine.

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by universe on 22.12.14 2:02

Universe to Ultima Thule & Khalessi....Amy Tierney the Supervisor of the Mini Club Creche says in her police statement in the files that " The Mini Club is closed on Sundays and that when she went into the Mccanns apartment 5a on the 3rd May she saw that the shutter was raised and the window open, She also says that the distance between the 5 apartment was seconds by foot". !!!!!!! Who do you think she was covering up for ???. My theories of what happened to Madeleine are taken from reading the case files.

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by universe on 22.12.14 3:07

Universe to Late to the case... re Mr. Murat & Mark Warners/ Oc involvement=...Iniitially, ( IMO ) Mark Warners/ OC did not know anything about the sedation matter, they would have just put cash $$$ ( & lots of it ) in envelopes (ha) for the Mccons to not mention that the nanny was minding the kids in apt, 5a on Sunday evening when Madeleine fell off the lounge/sofa and died. It suited the Mccons to have the financial ( no need to officially sue the OC), political , PR, legal etc support of the Mark Warner/ OC behind them. Eventually however, rumors of sedation start to spread and Murat now wants to change the ball game with both sides... This is now when the Mccons/ Tapas do their initial Mexican standoff with the Mark Warner/ Murat team &nail Murat.... Lawers are called in, Smithman says to the world "It was not murat he saw", and the charade can now continue.

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by ultimaThule on 22.12.14 3:14

In her witness statement Amy Tierney says "The hours of the club are from 09.00 to 12.30 and from 14.30 to 17.30, the club is closed on Sundays on that day it only offers the dinner service".
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/AMY-ELLEN-TIERNEY.htm

In her witness statement Charlotte Penington "states that on two different days, Sunday, 29th of April 2007, and on Thursday, 03rd of May 2007, she had direct contact with Madeleine McCann, telling her stories and speaking with her." http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/CHARLOTTE-PENNINGTON.htm

In her witness statement Catriona Baker "states that she knows the McCann family since last Sunday, the 29th of April, 2007, when they enrolled their daughter in the "Minis" service. She replies that since that date and until Thursday, the 03rd of May, 2007, she was with Madeleine every day, but is unable to specify if she was present on the Sunday morning"
http://www.mccannfiles.com/id351.html

As the above link to Ms Baker's statement shows a copy of the Lobster (mini) club's attendance sheet for Sunday 29 April, it seems probable that an error was made when Amy Tierney's statement was transcribed and Saturday, when all of the kids clubs were closed as it was 'changeover day' and only the evening creche service was available to guests, became Sunday when in fact all of the childcare services were fully operational, universe.

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by universe on 22.12.14 3:52

Universe to Ultimathule.... I have been reading this case on here and the files for many, many years and of course I knew that the Mini Club was open on Sundays, it was obvious from the records, but Amy needs to be looked at by everyone as she states "It was only a 30 second walk from the Tapas reastraunt to apt. 5a, and the shutters were raised and the window was open"...I hope these statements of hers were not also typing/ translation errors ! My original starting point of this thread has been derailed a lot... and that point was... Catriona, Charlotte and Amy are the keys to this mystery/charade.

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by ultimaThule on 22.12.14 4:08

@universe wrote:Universe to  Ultimathule.... I  have been  reading  this case on here  and the files for many, many years  and of course  I knew that the  Mini Club  was open on Sundays, it was obvious from the  records, but Amy  needs to be looked  at by everyone  as she states  "It was only a 30 second  walk from the Tapas  reastraunt  to  apt. 5a,  and the shutters  were  raised and the window was open"...I  hope these statements of hers  were not also  typing/ translation errors !  My original  starting  point of this thread has been derailed a lot... and that point was... Catriona, Charlotte and Amy  are the keys to this  mystery/charade.

Surely any organisation sufficiently immoral to be party to covering up the death of a child and concealing the body would have no compunction about throwing one of its employees to the wolves if said worker had been babysitting the child when it fell victim to a fatal accident, universe, and more particularly when the organisation would doubtless have umpteen insurances in place to safeguard its profits from claims relating to accidental injury/death on its premises?

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by universe on 22.12.14 5:00

EeUniverse to Ultimathule...Please look at all the previous research and reports that have been done already into Mark Warners child minding licence ( & therefore their entire business) being in jepody even before the Mccanns even arrived in PDL due to using young, inexperienced, unqualified, non work visa approved nannies to mind children in their other clubs in Greece, Egypt etc. There was even an undercover reporters published account of these pior events. I would think that no insurance company would want to go anywhewe them. Three strikes and you're out re. keeping their child minding licence was their precarious situation before the Mccanns arrived. An abduction of Madeleine was a far better option for Warners than an acknowledgement that their nanny was in apt. 5a minding Madeleine on SUNDAY evening when she fell off the sofa and died. Far easier to pay off thee Mccons to there was no nanny there.

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by ultimaThule on 22.12.14 5:46

This article has been brought to the attention of this forum on a thread that I can't recall, universe http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-526248/The-shocking-truth-daycare-nurseries-creches.html but in the scenario you've outlined surely steps would have been taken, such as actual jemmied shutters, to give the McCanns' tale the credibility it so obviously lacks?

As it is the Ocean Club's manager, John Hill, said "there was no definite physical evidence that the girl had been abducted" http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/MARK_WARNER.htm

It also occurs to me that if, as you've suggested, the child met with a fatal accident on the Sunday, there would have been 4 days in which to ensure that all involved were word perfect and, from their assorted stumbling bumbling contradictory statements, this doesn't appear to have been the case.

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by universe on 22.12.14 5:51

Universe to Late ToCase... Re. sedation coverup=... Svengali David Payne, being Gerry's best friend and protector ("We have a pact") knew exactly what he was doing by letting the rest of the Tapas group of doctors in on the secret of the Mccanns sedating their children & convincing them all to keep silent about it. Payne could then. use their knowledge to continue to remain silent & continue with the charade of abduction for the Mccons benefit also. As the days & weeks went by after the 3rd. may 2007 Payne knew that the MEDICAL Duty Of Care that they were professionally bound by to report all sedation of children to authorities IMMEDIATLY as the twins lives were now at risk. Payne used this lack of early reporting by the Tapas group. to keep them silent to this day.

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by universe on 22.12.14 6:15

UNiverse to Ultimathule... John Hill, the Ocean Club manager was not party to the Warner/ Mccann knowledge (yet). He was not included in the loop yet. It was done on a "need to know" basis only at this stage. But I bet that David Hopkins, the Mark Warner managing director was in the loop very early !...See photo of Mr. Hopkins at church with the Mccons in PDL.

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by universe on 22.12.14 6:15

UNiverse to Ultimathule... John Hill, the Ocean Club manager was not party to the Warner/ Mccann knowledge (yet). He was not included in the loop yet. It was done on a "need to know" basis only at this stage. But I bet that David Hopkins, the Mark Warner managing director was in the loop very early !...See photo of Mr. Hopkins at church with the Mccons in PDL.

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by universe on 22.12.14 6:25

Universe to Ultimathule...The actors in this charade could have been given 14 thousand days to get their scripts straight, but you know that saying..." Oh what a tagled web we weave when first we practice to deceive" applies in this case.

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by ultimaThule on 22.12.14 6:31

@universe wrote:Universe to  Late ToCase...   Re. sedation  coverup=... Svengali David Payne, being Gerry's  best friend  and protector ("We have a pact") knew exactly what he was doing  by  letting the rest of the Tapas  group of doctors  in on the secret  of the Mccanns  sedating  their children  &  convincing them  all to keep  silent about it. Payne could  then. use their knowledge  to continue  to remain  silent & continue  with  the charade of  abduction  for the Mccons  benefit also.  As the  days &  weeks  went by after the 3rd. may 2007   Payne  knew  that  the MEDICAL  Duty  Of Care  that  they were  professionally  bound by to  report  all sedation  of  children  to  authorities  IMMEDIATLY  as the twins  lives  were  now at risk. Payne  used this lack of  early reporting  by the Tapas  group. to  keep  them  silent  to  this day.

As it seems to me that all it would have taken would have been for Oldfield and O'Brien to deny that any such conversation with Payne had taken place, I can't quite buy it, universe, but as I've long been convinced that Payne is pivotal I'll mull it over during the festive season.  In the meantime, a merry Yule to you and yours. .

Eta I've seen rank amateurs ad lib a far superior performance to the one the Tapas cast gave on the night of 3 May, since when it's been crystal clear that none of them would have made the grade as thespians except, possibly, as the back end of a pantomime horse but, even then, I suspect they'd create more manure than was called for in the script big grin .

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by Silver Shuffle on 22.12.14 19:46

thinking Silver Shuffle to Universe.... I think I'm not alone in thinking there was help from above. But if Mark Warner's were so powerful, how did the DNA end up in the car hired later? Wouldn't Madeleine have been whooshed immediately?

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by universe on 23.12.14 0:48

Universe to Silver Shuffle... Madeleine's body would have been removed on Tue..1st. may useing the blue bog into which body fluids etc must have leaked into by now because Madeleine died on SUNDAY evening in apt. 5a while a Mark Waener nanny was baby sitting her. The blue bag was put back ,empty, after the body was removed (on the same day that Mr. Murat rushed back to PDL) into the wardrobe &was photographed by the police. The blue bag , later innocently placed in the hire car boot thus spreading DNA & body fluid to it. This same blue bag then was lost....says it all really !!!

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by universe on 23.12.14 1:15

Universe to Ultimathule... Re. Sedation secrecy Pact. It was'nt as watertight as hoped by David Payne...His own wife Fiona in her statement suggested sedation of the twins & her concern somewhat. Maybe Fiona was fearfull of the risks of non disclosure of sedation knowledge but was still coerced into silence .

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by Latetothecase on 23.12.14 4:07

Is the cash in envelopes scenario the wrapper if you like for starting the fund, in your theory, Umiverse?

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by ultimaThule on 23.12.14 4:16

@universe wrote:Universe to Silver Shuffle...  Madeleine's body  would have been removed  on Tue..1st. may  useing the blue bog  into which  body fluids etc  must have  leaked into by now because  Madeleine  died on  SUNDAY  evening in apt. 5a  while a Mark Waener nanny  was baby sitting her.   The blue bag was put back ,empty, after the  body was removed  (on the same day that Mr. Murat  rushed back to PDL) into the wardrobe &was photographed  by the police. The blue bag , later  innocently  placed in the hire car boot thus spreading DNA & body fluid  to it. This same  blue bag  then  was lost....says it  all really !!!

It seems probable that the blue bag was used at some point to conceal or remove the body but I suspect that had any fluids of the type you describe leaked into it, it wouldn't have found its way back to 5A and most certainly wouldn't have been sitting on a shelf in the wardrobe in the early hours of 4 May, universe.

In addition, given the elapse of some weeks before the Scenic was hired any fluids would have been long since dry as dust which suggests, as Dr Amaral has posited, that the body was refrigerated before being transported to a further temporary or permanent place of concealment during which journey some partial defrosting occurred which occasioned the forensic evidence that was retrieved from the rear of the vehicle.  

Do you have any theory as to where the body may be found?

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by universe on 23.12.14 6:18

Universe to Ultima... Sadly, because some of my previous posts on here have been edited/deleted by the moderator/ admin due to their potentially libilist nature I can only say that David Hopkins, Craig Mayhew and Robert Murat could all answer your latest question to me. OMO, OMO, OMO & "Without Prejudice".

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by canada12 on 23.12.14 7:11

Universe wrote:
The blue bag , later  innocently  placed in the hire car boot thus spreading DNA & body fluid  to it

If the blue bag was in a condition to leak DNA and body fluid, IMO it would have smelled very bad by that point. IMO whoever placed the blue bag in the hire car boot would have been acutely aware of the smell. Nothing innocent about it. IMO.

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by plebgate on 23.12.14 8:48

@Latetothecase wrote:Yes, my bad saying DNA I meant anything that could be found re drugs forensically.

From where, another apartment perhaps,
as the one the world knows as 5a had no sign of MM, but the cleaner specifically recalled the special trainers in that apartment. Maybe a sub's footwear?

It has also been mentioned the lack of breakfast material in the kitchen considering they had decided to eat in their apartment every morning, which could indicate a quick switch imo.
I think that what you are saying is that apartment 5A was not their original apartment (I may be wrong),-  but if that was the case, wouldn't the housekeepers have had to have been "in on whatever " also?

I do not remember any statement to the police from housekeeping staff saying that it was not the original apartment and that they had been moved at some point.

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by plebgate on 23.12.14 8:51

@universe wrote: Universe to Ultima... Sadly, because some of my previous  posts on here  have  been edited/deleted  by  the moderator/ admin  due to their potentially  libilist nature I  can only say  that  David  Hopkins, Craig Mayhew and Robert Murat  could  all answer  your latest question  to me. OMO, OMO, OMO  &  "Without  Prejudice".
I am pleased to hear that some of your posts have been removed.   Mr. may well have said that he doesn't mind theories being put forth, but you have been naming others - without a shred of evidence to back up your theory.

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by universe on 23.12.14 9:52

Universe to Pebgate... How can a poster on here write their evidence on this site when it gets deleted for being possibly libalist material ???? It's a catch 22 situation.

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by jeanmonroe on 23.12.14 12:27

@universe wrote:Universe to Pebgate... How can  a poster on here  write their  evidence  on this site when it gets  deleted for being possibly libalist  material ???? It's a catch 22  situation.

"evidence" universe?

Unequivocal, proven, beyond contestation, "evidence"?

I'D like to 'see' that. winkwink

Always remember, "It's NOT what you 'know', it's what you can 'prove', in court"

Even OG only 'reckon' 'believe' their 'theories' they have come up with.

"Bungling burglar killed her' being OG's latest 'theory'

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Re: Follow the money trail.

Post by universe on 23.12.14 12:48

-Because my posts on other threads have suffered a lot of derailments, I thought it now best to put my personal theories, analysis together here under this thread that I started originally called "Follow The Money Trail" & which are all OMO &are all written "Without Prejudice ".
___ Would you give sympathy to parents who did not leave their children alone in apartment 5a on the SUNDAY evening but employed a Mark Warner nanny to mind them and the sofa accident happened and they covered it up with Mark Warners & Murat's help?. All to avoid an autopsy report (Mccanns) and loss of future childminding licence for the Mark Warner resort company.
--- The "Last Photo" of Madeleine by the pool was taken on SUNDAY 29th. the only (ETA one of the few) hot days during that week & not on Thursday 3rd. as the con artists want the world to believe.
--- Madeleine died on SUNDAY evening while the Mccanns were dining at the Tapas & the nanny was paid to mind Madeleine & the twins in apartment 5a. The children sedated (as usual), & as the nanny was pre-occupied in the bedroom, bathroom, verandah or wherever, Madeleine woke up & fell off the lounge (sofa) whilst looking for her parents at the window above the sofa, unbeknowst to the nanny/babysitter.
----- The "Tennis Ball" photo is an obvious photoshopped picture of Madelleines face superimposed onto an older childs body, very easy to do, just ask any professional photographer.

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