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Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by Guest on 12.12.14 13:04

@Portia wrote:Did I hear this right?

I thought I heard the BBC anchor say, this morning, that Robert Murat is an arguido: A SUSPECT.

Now, since when is one arguido a suspect, and two other arguidos 'persons of interest'?

One would have thought that at the very least the Beeb would get it right, right?
Any one on here from Portugal? if previously being an arguido can he be reinterviewed with out that status?

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by noddy100 on 12.12.14 13:54

How can she say she only mentioned it to gerald when it was on the timeline?

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Off topic but doesn't merit a thread of its own.

Post by PeterMac on 12.12.14 14:29

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2870825/Councillor-used-job-help-murderer-son-cheat-justice-20-years-Mother-knife-obsessed-man-jailed-killing-teenager-asked-police-questions-inquiry-provided-false-alibi.html

Councillor used her job to help murderer son cheat justice for 20 years:
Mother of man jailed for killing teenager Claire Tiltman in 1993 pumped police for information about inquiry and provided son with false alibi

Do we know of any other current cases where parents have "pumped police for information about the inquiry,' or where someone has tried to provide a false alibi ?

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by ultimaThule on 12.12.14 14:43

One long ongoing case comes to mind where the parents appear to have gone to quite extraordinary lengths to prise pump information from a regional police authority, and where their alibis would appear to be unsupported by any independent witness(es) to their whereabouts on a certain night back in 2007, PeterM, but their name currently escapes me. big grin

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by Guest on 12.12.14 15:12

Done and dusted for now.



Rebecca Barry @BeccaBarry  ·  18m 18 minutes ago
Questioning of Robert Murat has now finished. #McCann
0 replies . 5 retweets 2 favourites

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by tungsten tel on 12.12.14 15:45

Not sure this would be the correct thread to put this in - if not please move . Ive posted on here about the Tory party worker (unpaid I think) who's been telling me for about 6 months that Theresa May will lead the party next year .He texted me last night saying " Theresa May mark my words 2015" . Got me thinking with the election coming up would a new leader who as Home Secretary pushed to solve the Mccann case and in the process helped expose the Government of the day (or high powered members) helped in the cover up .Vote winner for sure . Murat may help close the case but maybe a bit ofPolitical intervention may help for once . Only my thoughts obviously .

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by jeanmonroe on 12.12.14 15:56

If, IF, Mrs May 'survives' the gentle 'grilling' on Monday, 15th December, by the Home Affairs Select Commitee.

Who will, i'm led to believe, 'ask' her about UK's possible HO 'cover up' regarding CIA report', possible HO 'cover up' regarding Vine immigration report, possible HO 'cover up' regarding 'child abuse' report.

Busy busy Mrs May!

Come through that LOT, unscathed, she deserves to be 'leader'!

HO! HO! HO!

She'll probably try to 'blame' it ALL,.......... on Santa!

"effing terrorist Santa, entering UK air space, without HO permission. Give 'im an ASBO, oh, AND a UK passport" winkwink

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by tungsten tel on 12.12.14 16:20

You "May" well be right , will pass that on to him in a while . Mind you he's convinced , reckons he's got inside info on the leader bit . Wonder if Theresa May (TM mmmm) will manage to use all available whitewash on herself . None left for the other TM .

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by j.rob on 12.12.14 17:12

Snipped from the article above:

One thing that is obvious from the CD of evidence released by the Portuguese authorities in July 2008, in what was an inexplicably selective disclosure, is the identification by Miss Jane Tanner of Mr Robert Murat as Madeleine McCann’s “abductor”. She picked him out in a surveillance exercise on Sunday 13th May 2007 and persisted in her allegation against him and did not withdraw it until her interviews with the Leicestershire Police in April 2008. You have to dig deep into the CD and other sources to pull everything together, but here is what happened and it is incredible.


THE SUPPOSED SIGHTING OF THE ABDUCTOR


In the early hours of Friday 4th May 2007, Miss Tanner approached GNR Officer, Nelson da Costa (statements at folios 417, 1340 and 3285) and told him that she had seen an “individual” running and carrying a “child” who was “clearly” wearing pyjamas. The Officer did not consider the sighting credible because when he asked Miss Tanner to describe the “individual” she was unable to do so: excusing herself because it had been very dark. The Officer wondered, if it had been so dark, how she had been able to “clearly” see the child’s pyjamas.


---------


The timing of this is very interesting, imo. Because it was also 'in the early hours' of Friday 4th May 2007 that Matt, in the company of OC resort manager, allegedly 'woke up' TV director Jez Wilkins and his journalist wife, Bridget O'Donnell and told the pair that Gerry McCann had seen Jez outside the apartment 5A within the time-frame of when Madeleine was allegedly abducted. At 9..15pm to be precise. 


It is not only incredible that the couple were fast asleep when the whole resort was in chaos. It is also incredible that neither Gerry or Kate -  immediately upon the discovery that Madeleine had been 'stolen' -  did not rush around to Jez's apartment at shortly after 10pm  and grill  him about who he saw when wandering around the resort with his pram at the precise time that the abductor supposedly struck and stole Madeleine. 


Given that Gerry had allegedly checked on his children at 9pm and everything was fine. And Kate allegedly found Madeleine missing at 10pm, any person outside 5A apartment during this time period - especially, one assumes, one who is even pushing a potential get-away vehicle (a pram) in which to have hidden Madeleine - is obviously a key eye-witness as well, of course, as a potential suspect.


We know that Jez and his pram are an important part of the drama because Kate writes about this supposed encounter in her dreadful book. And Jane Tanner in the absurd 'reconstruction' of the events of that fateful night in the dreadful 'Madeleine was Here' series goes into quite a bit of detail about where Jez was standing when Gerry allegedly bumped into him outside the apartment. Even to the extent of spelling out which way Jez was facing and which direction his pram was facing. She seems to find the subject of Jez and his pram quite amusing, judging by her behaviour and facial expressions. And she jokes about Kate having been moaning about Gerry taking too long over his 9pm check because he might have stayed in the apartment to watch 'footie'.


Apart from being incredibly inappropriate behaviour, given that this concerns events around the alleged abduction of Madeleine (by a paedophile TM suspect) it also, imo, serves to flag up Jez massively. Which is most certainly not a coincidence in my book. 


So what WAS Jez' role in the drama?


And what WAS Murat's role?


If Murat was a 'patsy' - whether wittingly or not - then he certainly was handsomely financially rewarded. A £600,000 lump sum (tax free?) is certainly not be sniffed at by someone who used to work in a turkey-processing factory. And he still lives in the Luz area, which suggests that his reputation is not in tatters otherwise one assumes he would be living a low-key life miles away from where he had the grievous and tragic misfortune of suffering from a heinous miscarriage of justice.


And it is also of interest, imo, that it was a Mirror journalist in the UK who flagged up suspicions about Murat after watching him on TV.


The whole thing has been a giant media hoax, imo. 

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by j.rob on 14.12.14 23:06

I guess sick old Rupert and his hideous cronies saw how much money they could make (as if he/they need it) out of the reporting and coverage of the terrible 'disappearances' (and of course subsequently found out to be murders) of  Holly and Jessica; April Jones and also Milly Dowler and thought they would carry on the gravy train with Madeleine McCann allegedly being stolen by a random mystery person/paedophile.

SICK, SICK, SICK.

Toxic. The Murdoch organisation was a toxic place to work. But I never knew it could possibly get even more toxic.

So utterly disgusting.

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by j.rob on 14.12.14 23:26

And it is also of interest, imo, that it was a Mirror journalist in the UK who flagged up suspicions about Murat after watching him on TV.


The whole thing has been a giant media hoax, imo


-----




Hmmmm - I think I should have written the Mirror journalist who claimed that she became suspicious about Murat after watching him on TV.


And the Mirror journalist even, I do believe, claimed that Murat's behaviour reminded her of the behaviour of Ian Huntley, the murderer of Holly and Jessica, as he hung around the scene pretending to be helpful.


Pathetic. So pathetic. These stupid hacks think they are so clever. And the general public so thick. When it is actually the other way round. 


In my opinion of course!


big grin

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Just sayin

Post by Lara on 15.12.14 0:04

Robert Murat and Angus Symington, son of the owner of the Ocean Club Complex. ("estate agent Angus Symington, 37, has almost identical hair, complexion, ...
Luis Antonio is the estranged husband of Robert Murat's girlfriend Michaela Walczuch
and David Payne all look very similar
nod

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by Tony Bennett on 15.12.14 0:26

Here's a very interesting message put down anonymously the other day on the 'CRISTOBELL UNSOUND' blog run by Rosalinda Hutton.

I've tidied it up slightly for spelling and punctuation:

QUOTE

Cristobell.

You're like mother Teresa or even Jenny Murat on your defending of Robert Murat.

You say things like "Robert would not hurt a fly" and "Robert loves children" and "Robert just got a bit of porn on his computer" and "Robert just told a few lies to the police".

Well, Robert heard no commotion on the the night of Thursday 3rd May - yet he lives only yards away [from Apartment G5A].

Robert hires a car.

Robert has a strange chat with Martin Brunt.

Gerry McCann is asked "Do you know Robert Murat?" He answers 'No comment'.

Jenny Murat...
Sally Eveleigh...
Sergei Malinka...
Ralph Eveleigh...
Fazackerley...

all more dodgy than Robert Murat's eye 


UNQUOTE

What can it all mean?

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The truth will out

Post by Lara on 15.12.14 0:28

Indeed Tony spin

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by Tony Bennett on 15.12.14 0:39

@Lara wrote:Robert Murat and Angus Symington, son of the owner of the Ocean Club Complex ["estate agent Angus Symington, 37, has almost identical hair, complexion...]

Luis Antonio is the estranged husband of Robert Murat's girlfriend Michaela Walczuch

and David Payne

all look very similar...
All look dodgy, you mean?

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by Lara on 15.12.14 0:41

not dodgy just similar, ok you're right blommin well dodgy Wink  drama Will be interesting to see how this play's out Tony

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by Tony Bennett on 15.12.14 0:51

@Lara wrote:not dodgy just similar, ok you're right blommin well dodgy Wink  drama Will be interesting to see how this play's out Tony
@ Lara

But please see the following extract from my 2010 article on Murat: 'From Arguido to Applause', especially the bits in red:

+++++++++++++++++++++++

So by 1 January, Murat was back in the frame, at least according to Dr Kate McCann and the Daily Mail, with Dr Kate McCann strongly hinting at ‘questions which need to be answered’ and ‘doubts’.

Extraordinarily, just one week later, the Daily Mail ran a story which said exactly the reverse. One could be forgiven for thinking that those responsible for the McCanns’ public relations were not happy with the 1 January article and wished to change it.

So here’s what Vanessa Allen wrote in the Mail just one week later:

QUOTE

Madeleine witnesses ‘may have mistaken this friend of the McCanns for Murat’ on night she disappeared [ Daily Mail ]

“Doubt was cast on the evidence of several key witnesses in the Madeleine McCann disappearance last night. Those who said they saw suspect Robert Murat outside the family's holiday apartment on the night she vanished may have named the wrong man, it was revealed.

“Detectives believe the witnesses who said they saw the British expat could have confused him with a friend of Kate and Gerry McCann, David Payne, who was out searching for the missing three-year-old…

“A series of witnesses have given statements claiming to have seen him around the Ocean Club apartment complex in the hours after Mrs McCann, 39, raised the alarm. They include three friends of the McCanns, Russell O'Brien, Fiona Payne and Rachael Oldfield, who later confronted Mr Murat at a police station after he was made a suspect and said he offered to help them search that night.

“Mark Warner nanny Charlotte Pennington said she saw him hanging around outside the Ocean Club's reception at about 10pm. British holidaymaker Jayne Jensen, an unnamed British barrister and two unidentified British tourists all claim to have seen him around the complex that night.

But none of them knew the 34-year-old property consultant before that night. Police are examining the theory that they could have confused him with Dr David Payne. The medical researcher, who is 41, was searching around the complex that night and - in a street lit by orange streetlights - could easily have been mistaken for Mr Murat. Mr Murat's lawyer Francisco Pagarete told the Daily Mail: ‘Robert has always said the witnesses were mistaken. He was not there that night’.

A source close to the inquiry said: ‘The similarity between the two has rendered many witness accounts virtually worthless’.

But he added: ‘What is baffling is that Mr Payne's wife and two of his friends are among those who claim to have seen Mr Murat outside the McCanns' apartment that night. You'd think a wife would recognise her own husband’.”

UNQUOTE

The story had changed dramatically, within a week, from ‘Eight people saw Robert Murat that night’ to ‘They all probably mistook him for Dr David Payne’. At least the Daily Mail told its readers at the end of the article how utterly absurd it was to suggest that Fiona Payne she might have mistaken Robert Murat for her own husband. It was another story that had the imprint of media manipulator Clarence Mitchell all over it.

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Doubts

Post by Lara on 15.12.14 1:07

Tony, you and me have been following this case from day one, through all the forums, I agree there is something not quite right.
I read the .Madeleine book recently, and had more doubts.
What I do know is the abduction is not really believable under the times given for the checks, what I do know is Eddie and Keela would not lie, the timelines are either a mistake or an invention and I still believe it was 2nd unless it happened even earlier which is entirely possible, maybe the 2nd if not before, lets have some leeway. Maddie Maddie Maddie or was it daddy Daddy daddy.
I am now doing a forensic science course
I do have a feeling this case will be solved soon, because I'm not going anywhere and neither are you.
For me it all points to a tragic accident although if that happened to one of my kids I would be devastated unable to function, even the thought of it.
Goodnight  byebye

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by jeanmonroe on 15.12.14 14:37

I can't imagine that the 'window, innocent in 15 seconds, washer' would be too 'impressed' by Operation Strange's re-questioning of RM, can you?

HE 'supposedly' offered RM a 'job' didn't he?

Who knows what RM TOLD 'officers', last week, about that particular 'offer' and WHY he was 'offered' it.

JOB 'offer'  to RM, 'backed' up, i believe, by RM's lawyer, who was witness to 'talks?'

istbc, on that.

Or indeed, what information, RM might have told officers, last week, about ANY er 'meetings' between himself and er, um, y'know, erm 'representatives' of erm, 'interested' parties, at the height of 'investigations'?  (2007)

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by Doug D on 19.12.14 17:18

Not sure where this twitter story has originated from, but interesting if true:

dewi lennard
‏‪@kikoratton
SY asking same 253 questions of pig farmer, Murat, Walczuch, laundryman - waste of time.
But PJ wanting to re-interrogate RM - interesting.
   
6:40 AM - 19 Dec 2014
 

And there’s a new Lazz up this afternoon as well:
 
http://l-azzeri-lies-in-the-sun.com/Merry_Christmas_Mr_Murat.html

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by aquila on 19.12.14 21:26

@Doug D wrote:Not sure where this twitter story has originated from, but interesting if true:

dewi lennard
‏‪@kikoratton
SY asking same 253 questions of pig farmer, Murat, Walczuch, laundryman - waste of time.
But PJ wanting to re-interrogate RM - interesting.
   
6:40 AM - 19 Dec 2014
 

And there’s a new Lazz up this afternoon as well:
 
http://l-azzeri-lies-in-the-sun.com/Merry_Christmas_Mr_Murat.html
...and another great post from l-azz

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by aiyoyo on 20.12.14 0:11



@Doug D wrote:Not sure where this twitter story has originated from, but interesting if true:

dewi lennard
‏‪@kikoratton
SY asking same 253 questions of pig farmer, Murat, Walczuch, laundryman - waste of time.
But PJ wanting to re-interrogate RM - interesting.
   
6:40 AM - 19 Dec 2014
 

And there’s a new Lazz up this afternoon as well:
 
http://l-azzeri-lies-in-the-sun.com/Merry_Christmas_Mr_Murat.html

If true, it's another one of those Oh Lordie Lordie Lord moments....when you're hit in the face with something you least expect......PJ wanting to "re-interrogate" RM...  third time recuring....interesting!
 
If true, give it time for Santa Claus and his reindeer to masticate the mince pie and carrot and gone back to lapland to hibernate once again, then the "re-interrogation" will recur will be a good bet.

As again, I-azz has written an excellent one.  

I am particularly drawn to this:  "It's not us that has committed this crime, it's the person who has gone into that apartment and taken a little girl away from her family"  and am taken aback how I'd missed Kate's trip up.  


It's her admission - that they'd not committed "this" crime...that intrigues me.
   
A denial when no direct accusation (of any particular crime) had been put to her is an odd thing to say. Also, what's "this" (nature of) crime that's held in her mind when she volunteer a denial.

Using "little girl" and "her family" seem detached, cold and impersonal. Why not use "Madeleine" and "us" when talking about her beloved missing Madeleine.  

Ironically, that is an inverse-emotion statement -  the first half mirrors emotion filled touche feely personal (raw and sensitive to her) - whereas the latter half reflects detachment (no reality) as if she was bearing an abstract child in mind when she said that, since she "knew" EXACTLY what happened to the tangible child.

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by Tony Bennett on 14.01.15 23:49

@Tony Bennett wrote:Here's a very interesting message put down anonymously the other day on the 'CRISTOBELL UNSOUND' blog run by Rosalinda Hutton.

I've tidied it up slightly for spelling and punctuation:

QUOTE

Cristobell.

You're like mother Teresa or even Jenny Murat on your defending of Robert Murat.

You say things like "Robert would not hurt a fly" and "Robert loves children" and "Robert just got a bit of porn on his computer" and "Robert just told a few lies to the police".

Well, Robert heard no commotion on the night of Thursday 3rd May - yet he lives only yards away [from Apartment G5A].

Robert hires a car.

Robert has a strange chat with Martin Brunt.

Gerry McCann is asked "Do you know Robert Murat?" He answers 'No comment'.

Jenny Murat...
Sally Eveleigh...
Sergei Malinka...
Ralph Eveleigh...
Fazackerley...

all more dodgy than Robert Murat's eye

UNQUOTE

What can it all mean?
Further to the above post back in December on Cristobell's blog, and being reminded of the many queries about Robert Murat's role in this whole affair, I went back to look at the report by Inspector Pedro Varanda -  the inspector who was so troubled by Murat's conduct as translator that on 11 May 2007 - eight days into the investigation - he penned an urgent note to the investigation co-ordinator, Dr Goncalo Amaral.

I've extracted his main comments.

They are damning.

Here they are:


1. ‘displaying an unusual curiosity about the investigation’

2. ‘insistently - and repeatedly - questioned me about the identity of possible suspects’

3. ‘insistently - and repeatedly - questioned me about the strategy outlined by the head  of the investigation’

4. ‘insistently - and repeatedly - questioned me about and the work that might possibly have been considered for the coming days’

5. ‘unusual and absolutely inappropriate’ behaviour

6. ‘covertly trying to catch glimpses of various items being prepared for the case files’

7. Persistently tried to influence the conduct of the investigation.


Inspector Varanda was also concerned that Murat:

'manifested an enormous knowledge about the functioning of the "Ocean Club" and

‘manifested an enormous knowledge about the routines followed by the McCann family’.  

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

That all creates a giant question mark. WHY did Robert Murat act like this?

I can think of only four possible answers:

A. He was a naturally curious and helpful person and was doing his level best to assist the Portuguese police

B. He was doing all this to defend himself because he had somehow been involved in events leading up to Madeleine's reported disappearance

C. He was doing all this on behalf of unnamed others, or

D. A combination of (B) and (C).


I wonder which it was??    

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by Angelique on 15.01.15 1:47

Maybe he was called to Portugal (job) to actually be mistakenly identified. Maybe it was part of the agenda. After all - all participants have to be on scene as it were.

A Double (or three) if you like.

What is so interesting is that statements identifying him can be then changed later without any consequence at all.

I dare say : "I just thought it was Murat" is plausible but would your local Police not raise questions.

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Re: Is Robert Murat About To Close This Case?

Post by woodforthetrees on 15.01.15 10:47

@jeanmonroe wrote:I can't imagine that the 'window, innocent in 15 seconds, washer' would be too 'impressed' by Operation Strange's re-questioning of RM, can you?

HE 'supposedly' offered RM a 'job' didn't he?

Who knows what RM TOLD 'officers', last week, about that particular 'offer' and WHY he was 'offered' it.

JOB 'offer'  to RM, 'backed' up, i believe, by RM's lawyer, who was witness to 'talks?'

istbc, on that.

Or indeed, what information, RM might have told officers, last week, about ANY er 'meetings' between himself and er, um, y'know, erm 'representatives' of erm, 'interested' parties, at the height of 'investigations'?  (2007)
Based on Brians 'i'll buy what i want and what i want i get' mentality and Murats need/want for money and seeming like of the limelight, it probably went something like this....

Brian: You've been close to whats going on so tell us everything
Murat: I am close to the case yes and know lots, but i'm not going to tell you anything...unless you pay me
Brian: I'll give you €500
Murat: I want $500k
Brian: Ha ha, no. I will pay you a consultancy fee to work with us for the next few weeks at $200 per day, plus you tell us everything you know so far
Murat: This discussion is over.

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