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Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by PeterMac on 01.10.14 15:18

Is there any reason Missing People did not feature Alice ?

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by aiyoyo on 01.10.14 15:25

The investigation continues to be treated as a missing person's inquiry but due to the high risk nature of this investigation and the concerns for Alice's welfare the Homicide and Major Crime Command (HMCC) are now leading on the investigation but continue to be supported by officers from Ealing.’

Homicide and Major Crime Command leading the investigation using specialist dogs......

Sounds familiar?

The Police know more than we are told.....

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by Doug D on 01.10.14 16:30

PeterMac,

When she first went missing I am pretty sure I had a look and she was on there, although she's obviously been taken off now.

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by PeterMac on 01.10.14 16:41

@Doug D wrote:PeterMac,
When she first went missing I am pretty sure I had a look and she was on there, although she's obviously been taken off now.
I wondered about that, but perhaps it might be nice if they put a few words of condolence to family and friends . . .
rather than simply Whooshing her as no longer useful for fund raising purposes !

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by Doug D on 01.10.14 19:15

Not that anyone had much doubt, but:
 
Met Police Press Update, 01-Oct-2014 19:03
 
Body identified as that of Alice Gross
 
We can now confirm that sadly the body recovered yesterday (Tuesday, 30 September) from the River Brent is that of 14-year-old Alice Gross. 

The family has been informed of this development and the investigation continues.

A post-mortem examination began today (Wednesday, 1 October) at Uxbridge Mortuary. Due to the complex nature of this investigation the post-mortem is still ongoing and will resume tomorrow (Thursday, 2 October).




+++Statement from Rosalind Hodgkiss and Jose Gross - Parents of Alice Gross

"We have been left completely devastated by the recent developments and it is difficult to comprehend that our sweet and beautiful daughter was the victim of a terrible crime. Why anyone would want to hurt her is something that we are struggling to come to terms with. 

“Alice was a loving and much loved daughter and sister, a quirky live spark of a girl, beautiful inside and out. She was a funny companion, a loyal friend, both passionate and compassionate, and so talented with a bright future ahead of her. She brought so much joy to our family and those who knew her.

“We still don't know who is responsible for this crime and we ask that people continue to help the police by giving them information that could help bring the perpetrator to justice. 

“We would like to thank all those that have supported us in our efforts to find Alice, especially the local community; it is comforting to know that so many people care. 

"This is a personal and private tragedy and one which we want to be allowed to deal with in that manner, rather than fearing any individual or group will use it to further any political agenda. This is a time for grieving and not a time for anger or recriminations.

"We trust that the press will behave responsibly and not publish any material that might jeopardise any future criminal proceedings.

"We now ask for our privacy to be respected to allow us time to grieve as a family.”




++++ Statement on behalf of Brentside High - School Alice attended

"Our thoughts and sympathy are with Alice’s family at this time. 

"Alice was an outstanding and talented student who will be sorely missed from our school community. This is a very sad day for our school and we are devastated by this tragic loss. We are doing everything we can to support each other and will continue to do so in the days and weeks ahead. 

"We would like to thank the MPS for their efforts in finding Alice and hope that the perpetrator of this awful crime is brought to justice very soon. 

"If anyone has any information that may be of use to the police’s murder inquiry please do come forward.



“To conclude, may I now ask you to respect the privacy of Alice’s family and our school community as we come to terms with this sad news.”

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by PeterMac on 02.10.14 18:13

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2777189/As-Alice-parents-tell-agony-questions-police-body-close-sighting.html
Alice was buried in an 'underwater grave': Police reveal murdered teenager was wrapped in plastic sheets and hidden in riverbed under a pile of heavy logs
Schoolgirl's body was found on Tuesday in the River Brent in west London
The 14-year-old was found wrapped in plastic sheets and covered with logs
She was found in shallow stretch of water which police had searched before

Today tributes and flowers were laid in Hanwell in memory of the teenager
Alice's parents Jose Gross and Rosalind Hodgkiss 'completely devastated'
Parents say they're 'comforted' by outpouring of support from community

I suspect it was the dogs which caused the police to look again.
I suspect they did a wade search, from those pictures of the attractive young girl from the Fire and Rescue in a dry suit but no mask.I would not have allowed that, incidentally.
So you then rely on what you step on, and if it is a log you think nothing more about it.

As in other recent cases where humans have relied on their own pathetic senses and not on the dogs' almost unbelievable ones.

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by j.rob on 02.10.14 19:19

Snipped from a post above:


So why did it take nearly a month before the police started talking about this Latvian man - who apparently after trying to kill his wife, managed the second time by beating her to death, then burying her. Who after serving his time, came to the UK, married and moved into accomodation owned by a charged Paedadophile (who was serving time for his crime - when he died, very coincidentally, 2 weeks ago....) The Latvian man - who also had faced charges here in UK back in I believe 2007 for sexual assault on a 14 year, but charges were dropped for what reason I don't know - but we do know that he hasn't been seen since Alice's disappearance on that day.


So not that difficult to follow the paper trail then? 

Assuming that this is a case of a complete stranger abduction and murder? I wonder how close the killer lived to the family? Whether there had been any connections at all? He had done building work nearby or something?

So often there do appear to be some tenuous links. Even if just geographical.

For instance, in the April Jones case the murderer was well know to April. So she trusted him. And there were complicated links to wider family. 

In the Millie Dowler case, it is possible that the abductor duped her into getting into the car by pretending he was a neighbour or knew a neighbour, for instance? Or maybe came up with a story that was credible and so gained her trust. She was so close to home and school and familiar territory that she probably just felt 'safe'. Maybe he had become familiar with her routine?

So the dogs can even alert when a body is in water, then?

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by BlueBag on 02.10.14 19:26

I would like to know how they identified the Latvian from that poor CCTV clip?

Also how long did it take them to identify him (I presume all CCTV video was looked at almost immediately).

He disappeared from his home 6 (SIX) days after Alice disappeared.

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by ChippyM on 03.10.14 13:11

@j.rob wrote:Snipped from a post above:


So why did it take nearly a month before the police started talking about this Latvian man - who apparently after trying to kill his wife, managed the second time by beating her to death, then burying her. Who after serving his time, came to the UK, married and moved into accomodation owned by a charged Paedadophile (who was serving time for his crime - when he died, very coincidentally, 2 weeks ago....) The Latvian man - who also had faced charges here in UK back in I believe 2007 for sexual assault on a 14 year, but charges were dropped for what reason I don't know - but we do know that he hasn't been seen since Alice's disappearance on that day.


So not that difficult to follow the paper trail then? 

Assuming that this is a case of a complete stranger abduction and murder? I wonder how close the killer lived to the family? Whether there had been any connections at all? He had done building work nearby or something?

So often there do appear to be some tenuous links. Even if just geographical.
................

My suspicion is that Alice walked the same route regularly and unfortunately there are sick people that watch out for young people with such routines. Put this together with the fact that she was very petite and slight and that makes her an ideal target to who ever did this.

    The fact that the body was well hidden supports that the killer had planned this and probably did watch her go along this route at other times IMO.  How the killer managed to hide the body so well without anyone noticing is quite hard to believe but not impossible I suppose.  It's just awful that there are people like this, planning things out.

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by BlueBag on 03.10.14 13:25

If it was planned then what does that make the Latvian on the bike who was 15 minutes behind her?

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by ChippyM on 03.10.14 16:19

@BlueBag wrote:If it was planned then what does that make the Latvian on the bike who was 15 minutes behind her?


I'm not sure if i get your meaning BlueBag. Isn't it obvious what someone who plans something like this is? ......Or are you saying that being 15 minutes behind her means he hadn't planned anything?    He could still be aware roughly of the times she walked that route and gone out on his bike after thinking about what he might do for some time.

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by BlueBag on 03.10.14 17:58

@ChippyM wrote:
@BlueBag wrote:If it was planned then what does that make the Latvian on the bike who was 15 minutes behind her?

I'm not sure if i get your meaning BlueBag. Isn't it obvious what someone who plans something like this is? ......Or are you saying that being 15 minutes behind her means he hadn't planned anything?    He could still be aware roughly of the times she walked that route and gone out on his bike after thinking about what he might do for some time.

We don't know any of that.

15 minutes is a long time and would be a weird plan.

The only facts we have are he was CCTV filmed on a bike 15 minutes after Alice passed that point (where there other people on various CCTV?).

And he disappeared from his home 6 days after Alice disappeared.

Presumably people had been looking at CCTV from the off.

I don't know what happened. But I have questions. It could have been him. I don't know. Never assume.

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by PeterMac on 03.10.14 21:18

@BlueBag wrote:
I don't know what happened. But I have questions. It could have been him. I don't know. Never assume.

That is one of the reasons that have not yet gone for a EAW.
If they did, they have to have enough evidence to convict on a legal aided "No Comment"
which as we know, is difficult to get round in a jurisdiction which does not permit coercion.
You can't even persuade a mother of a missing child to tell the truth about what happened, or even tell a story about ANYTHING that happened,
so why would a suspected murderer feel under any more pressure ?

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by sallypelt on 04.10.14 12:42

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/alice-gross-and-the-mystery-of-the-two-women-who-disappeared-nearby-9773904.html

How VERY strange

The body of missing schoolgirl Alice Gross had been dug into an underwater pit, wrapped in plastic sheets and covered with heavy logs, it emerged today.

Tonight police said a post-mortem examination on the 14-year-old's body had proved inconclusive, and that more tests were needed to establish a cause of death.

While the manner of Miss Gross's murder remains mystery, the lengths her killer went to in order to conceal her body were laid bare this afternoon.

The body was found on Tuesday night in a shallow stretch of the River Brent in west London that police had searched before. It was just 500 yards from where Alice's rucksack and shoes were found on 2 September, shortly after she went missing.


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2777189/As-Alice-parents-tell-agony-questions-police-body-close-sighting.html#ixzz3FAypJ8tb


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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by BlueBag on 04.10.14 13:13

@sallypelt wrote:http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/alice-gross-and-the-mystery-of-the-two-women-who-disappeared-nearby-9773904.html

How VERY strange

The body of missing schoolgirl Alice Gross had been dug into an underwater pit, wrapped in plastic sheets and covered with heavy logs, it emerged today.

Tonight police said a post-mortem examination on the 14-year-old's body had proved inconclusive, and that more tests were needed to establish a cause of death.

While the manner of Miss Gross's murder remains mystery, the lengths her killer went to in order to conceal her body were laid bare this afternoon.

The body was found on Tuesday night in a shallow stretch of the River Brent in west London that police had searched before.  It was just 500 yards from where Alice's rucksack and shoes were found on 2 September, shortly after she went missing.


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2777189/As-Alice-parents-tell-agony-questions-police-body-close-sighting.html#ixzz3FAypJ8tb


Maybe the Latvian had the plastic sheets and logs on the back of his bike, next to the spade.

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by aiyoyo on 04.10.14 13:45

The details that went into hiding the body would suggest disposal pre-planning.




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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by joyce1938 on 04.10.14 13:48

Maybe it was not the Latvian chap at all ? ofciurse having info. on his past has made it a possibility.but we must not just assume it true. joyce1938

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by sallypelt on 04.10.14 13:54

@joyce1938 wrote:Maybe it was not the Latvian chap at all ? ofciurse having info. on his past has made it a possibility.but we must not just assume it true. joyce1938

Joyce, I am in agreement with you. The fact that the Latvian has a past history of murder, and that he disappeared after Alice went missing, there are still many unanswered questions, and I am not going to start a debate on this case. It should be left to the police at this stage. However, I will stick my neck on the block and say that whatever happened to Alice, happened close to where she was found, and she never left that vicinity after she died.

Just my personal logic, of course, and I may be completely wrong.

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by joyce1938 on 04.10.14 14:08

thanks sallypelt for your reply ,wasn't she not too far from home ?joyce1938

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by sallypelt on 04.10.14 16:30


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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by BlueBag on 04.10.14 16:32

Why am I not surprised?

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by sallypelt on 04.10.14 16:38

@BlueBag wrote:Why am I not surprised?

Neither am I surprised, Bluebag. I have had my views on this case since they released the CCTV capture of him. I won't explain what I think at the moment, but I have told my family members about my theory, and it's unfolding exactly as I have said. But I will wait for further information.

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by PeterMac on 04.10.14 16:45

Strange and unusual.

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by joyce1938 on 04.10.14 16:47

Could this be a patsie as you say petermac ,strange

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Re: Missing 14 year old girl - Alice Gross

Post by bobbin on 04.10.14 16:50

@joyce1938 wrote:Could this be a patsie as you say petermac ,strange
as in did he fall or was he pushed ?

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